If all Hybrids will not be built, will ford give option to purchase EB

[OXHB619]

I'm failing to see how that is being selfish. For example, let's say I ordered my kid an XBOX Series X for Christmas. But someone else who ordered a Playstation 5 a day before I placed my XBOX order later realized that they might not get their Playstation and was able to change their order to an XBOX and get one that came available before I got my order filled. This in turn required my order to take longer and thus not arrive by Christmas. They didn't order an XBOX, they ordered a Playstation. Likewise, they didn't order an EB, they ordered a Hybrid. Different game system, different product. Different engine, different product.

Honestly, I'm not bent out of shape. Just trying to understand the other way of thinking. Now I will be if this scenario plays out.

Also, for the record, I already bought my kid's XBOX Series X and have it stashed away for Christmas.

Change that to someone else ordered a Series X and the day after you ordered a Series S. Microsoft said hey, we ran out of X's but don't want your holiday to be ruined, can we replace the X with an S, so that we can still ship to you by Christmas. Plenty for S's for everyone, we just can't make enough X's.

I really don't think you have anything to worry about, I imagine most EB orders will have a much better experience for '22 than they did for '23. Also, probably 75% of Hybrid orders have no desire to an EB, so they would rather risk it than make the change. ( Myself included IF I hadn't placed a 2nd order in 2021 after I felt like the first dealer was going to screw me. Glad I did. )

I am not really in the race though, Fords special offer is garbage for a Lariat + Lux Hybrid, it will cost me more money to get the same truck with less features. I am pretty sure the dealer will F that up too, and it will never get made. Only way I would buy it is if the Hybrid market is stupid at that time, but I think getting stupid used prices on trade are behind us, even with high demand like the Hybrids.

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[BradnChristine]

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Honestly, I'm not bent out of shape. Just trying to understand the other way of thinking. Now I will be if this scenario plays out.
...

Sometimes its just Karma. Like the brand-spanking-new folks who are getting built in the first few weeks of production. They should buy lottery tickets, as they won. When they put us 2022 folks with cancelled VINs into place, there will be a gap before any more new 2023 folks get put into the building state.

 

[NoVaJimmy]

I'm failing to see how that is being selfish.

It is selfish and what you're not understanding is that some of those hybrids would have been built before your Ecoboost anyway. Also, if Ford did offer the customer the ability to change their order there's no way that all of those hybrid orders are changing to Ecoboost. Also, do you understand how the allocation system works? It seems like you might be in for a rude awakening. Ford does not build these in the order they were received. Just to give you an example, I ordered my Ecoboost this past January and had it in less than 4 months. I happened to order from a large dealer in a large metropolitan area and they had a ton of allocation. There are people who ordered their Ecoboost well before me who are still waiting for various reasons. What I'm saying is that there's no rhyme or reason to order fulfillment so complaining that it's not fair that some transitioned Ecoboost orders might get built before yours seems a little futile.

 

[scotty]

4 misspellings and some interesting punctuation, while speaking about intelligence? And if it was so smart, why did you change it?

because i am not smart, and one of the members said it would be better if i put the title in a question form. so i did

 

[Kelli]

Some reasonable,,but there is a cost...loosing upset customers,,,expecially if other manufacturers produce alternative to the maverick...just don't know if the gain for Ford outweight the risk...

I like this forum it sharpens the mind to think critical...all of which we need to do in this country.

I agree, yet it will take YEARS for that thought process to affect Ford. I still think it will, it just won't help us now.

What will speed that up is when other automakers come out with their alternatives. When Ford sees orders cancelled and the other automaker's sales skyrocket in the same segment, THEN they will be like OOPS, our bad so sad (NOT!).

 

[minitrucknuts]

If the trend over the last 3 months continues, the car sales industry should be much different come next summer when stock dealer orders would theoretically start hitting lots. Most chip related issues should be resolved over the next 6 months (lots of capacity opening up right now). More importantly, the used car market is plummeting (down 15% since late June and continuing to fall by 1% per week). The high used car prices are a primary reason why dealers can get "over MSRP" right now on new vehicles. Finally, the foot traffic at dealerships are WAY down since interest rates went up. My guess is that the number of folks that legitimately "walk away" when their Maverick orders come in will be 2x or 3x what it was this year (due to higher interest rates, job loss, finding a cheaper used vehicle in the mean-time, etc.).

While there are definitely some supply constraints, most sources say that they are easing. Most projections are that auto-makers will be producing significantly more vehicles next year. As inventory goes up and demand goes down, I don't think most dealerships will be able to continue to sell at significantly over MSRP. My personal prediction is that "high demand" vehicles such at the Maverick Hybrid will still be at MSRP or slightly above but EB Mavericks will be selling for under MSRP come late next year. Only time will tell if this is correct but lots of data pointing to that direction (Black Book, YAA, JP Morgan, etc.).

I agree with all of that and think those are reasonable predictions. I only differ with you in that I probably feel stronger about the EB Mav also remaining a "high demand" vehicle.

 

[commadorebob]

Change that to someone else ordered a Series X and the day after you ordered a Series S. Microsoft said hey, we ran out of X's but don't want your holiday to be ruined, can we replace the X with an S, so that we can still ship to you by Christmas. Plenty for S's for everyone, we just can't make enough X's.

I think the concern is people jumping the line when it was known when we ordered the hybrids would be a lot more constrained. This was posted by the admin the day order banks opened: https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/f...t-as-of-9-16-22-packages-options-parts.20359/ Despite knowing beforehand the hybrid would be less available, dealerships still took way more orders than Ford can build. It isn't Ford saying "oops, we ran out!" It's Ford saying, "we told you we only had X amount to begin with."

But using the Xbox example, it's more in line to if Microsoft had a physical line and said "any one after this point will NOT get a Series X" and you got in line after that point anyway. Would it be fair to those who read the sign and got into the much shorter Series S line after you got there for you to jump in front simply because you got there first? Of course not. As you said, most of the hybrid orders will likely not make the jump but to the EB orders who followed instructions, or simply wanted an EB to begin with, there could be a feeling of unfairness if their orders get jumped by someone who "didn't follow the instructions" the first time.

To repeat what I said before, I don't think Ford will offer a conversion period. At best, they reopen retail orders for EB once they finish the last of the current batch and people simply have to place a brand new order. But I think the most likely outcome is Ford is done with retail orders for MY23. It'll be pure stock once the retail EBs are complete.

 

[reciprocating_ravioli]

I think the concern is people jumping the line when it was known when we ordered the hybrids would be a lot more constrained. This was posted by the admin the day order banks opened: https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/forum/threads/-2023-maverick-constraints-list-as-of-9-16-22-packages-options-parts.20359/ Despite knowing beforehand the hybrid would be less available, dealerships still took way more orders than Ford can build. It isn't Ford saying "oops, we ran out!" It's Ford saying, "we told you we only had X amount to begin with."

But using the Xbox example, it's more in line to if Microsoft had a physical line and said "any one after this point will NOT get a Series X" and you got in line after that point anyway. Would it be fair to those who read the sign and got into the much shorter Series S line after you got there for you to jump in front simply because you got there first? Of course not. As you said, most of the hybrid orders will likely not make the jump but to the EB orders who followed instructions, or simply wanted an EB to begin with, there could be a feeling of unfairness if their orders get jumped by someone who "didn't follow the instructions" the first time.

To repeat what I said before, I don't think Ford will offer a conversion period. At best, they reopen retail orders for EB once they finish the last of the current batch and people simply have to place a brand new order. But I think the most likely outcome is Ford is done with retail orders for MY23. It'll be pure stock once the retail EBs are complete.

That's putting the onus on the dealers instead of Ford.

Did Ford come out with an actual, clear statement like "We only have capacity to build X amount of Hybrids - you can order one, but you might not be selected for production" They did not.

At no point did Ford say "Hey, anyone ordering after this point will not get a Hybrid, so better order the EB".

If someone ordered the first day order banks opened - why is it unreasonable to expect that they wouldn't get that vehicle built?


Instead they constantly brush it off and say "We are working on it" Ford absolutely refuses to actually come out and say they can't build them.

 

[JimmyH]

It is selfish and what you're not understanding is that some of those hybrids would have been built before your Ecoboost anyway. Also, if Ford did offer the customer the ability to change their order there's no way that all of those hybrid orders are changing to Ecoboost. Also, do you understand how the allocation system works? It seems like you might be in for a rude awakening. Ford does not build these in the order they were received. Just to give you an example, I ordered my Ecoboost this past January and had it in less than 4 months. I happened to order from a large dealer in a large metropolitan area and they had a ton of allocation. There are people who ordered their Ecoboost well before me who are still waiting for various reasons. What I'm saying is that there's no rhyme or reason to order fulfillment so complaining that it's not fair that some transitioned Ecoboost orders might get built before yours seems a little futile.

I totally understand how the allocation system works. Allocations do not matter in this situation, because if their order was a Hybrid and can't be built, it is passed up. I'm not expecting to be one of the first people to get my 23MY Maverick. Also, I'm not really upset at all. I'm just being that voice of reason for the other side of the coin that negatively affects those of us who originally ordered EB.

How is it any less selfish that those who ordered a Hybrid should be able to change their order to EB, essentially, adding thousands of new EB orders that mine has to compete with for scheduling? Because they had an order for a "Maverick" first? Because they've been riding this silly train for a year or more? I'm just saying that there are two sides to this.

In regards to the "those hybrids would have been built before your Ecoboost anyway". No, none of those hybrids would have been built before my EB. Because they can't build them. Again, not upset, just adding to the other side of the conversation.

On another note, those 235/65r18 Michelin Defender LTX, how are they? Fit, ride, MPG? I've had them a few times and love them. Infact, I'm putting new tires on my wife's car later this morning and was a little disappointed that they did not offer in the size I needed.

 

[commadorebob]

That's putting the onus on the dealers instead of Ford.

Did Ford come out with an actual, clear statement like "We only have capacity to build X amount of Hybrids - you can order one, but you might not be selected for production" They did not.

At no point did Ford say "Hey, anyone ordering after this point will not get a Hybrid, so better order the EB".

If someone ordered the first day order banks opened - why is it unreasonable to expect that they wouldn't get that vehicle built?


Instead they constantly brush it off and say "We are working on it" Ford absolutely refuses to actually come out and say they can't build them.

Ford told dealers what their expected allocation was and even Tim said they put in extra orders with the hope Ford will be able to fulfill them. So, yes, Ford said, "we expect to allow you this many trucks at a 35/65 ratio."

 

[reciprocating_ravioli]

Ford told dealers what their expected allocation was and even Tim said they put in extra orders with the hope Ford will be able to fulfill them. So, yes, Ford said, "we expect to allow you this many trucks at a 35/65 ratio."

They did not.

How can dealers know what other dealers are ordering? You expect hundreds of small town dealers to magically know what guys like Tim are doing, taking in nearly a thousand orders.

It's on Ford.

Who controls the order bank? Ford was perfectly capable of shutting off hybrid orders on day 1 if needed. Did they? No.

 

[LSchicago]

Someone needs to make a Meme with the "Ooh you almost had it" Fisherman dangling a Hybrid Maverick.

 

[ejouie]

This most likely will be settled at the dealership level.

When the stock EB start showing up just ask your dealer about getting one. They are inclined to make a sale as they don't make money on unfilled orders.

Remember that the goal from Ford is to get you in any Ford truck, not necessarily the truck you ordered.

 

[LSchicago]

They did not.

How can dealers know what other dealers are ordering? You expect hundreds of small town dealers to magically know what guys like Tim are doing, taking in nearly a thousand orders.

It's on Ford.

Who controls the order bank? Ford was perfectly capable of shutting off hybrid orders on day 1 if needed. Did they? No.

As much as I am loyal to Ford, and fully believe in their products, this hybrid Maverick fiasco has me pissed off. Yes they shut off orders of hybrids a day early. But they should've shut it off on Saturday instead on Monday night if they can only build 35% as hybrids. But it gets worse. Ford in all their "better idea" wisdom decided to sell the Hybrid Mavericks in Brazil for 2023, instead of taking care of orders already placed here at home. For that I lost a bit of respect for them. It's not right.

 

[ShadowBlack XL440]

Why doesnt Ford just put a $2-3k premium upcharge on the hybrid, they will still sell all they make and maybe even out the demand with the eco.

With a premium upcharge it would not be worth it to me and I would not place an order. My EB gets 30+ MPG and I don't have to pay the additional $100.00 hybrid licensing fee in Ohio. The reason I had interest in the Ford Maverick was the Hybrid economy and the 19,999 MSRP. Take away those 2 things and lose sales. How about just making the product that was offered at the advertised price?

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