👉🏻UPDATE👇🏻 Ford uses Torx PLUS ++ Here is the Difference

[Glen Baker LLC]

I know your evidence doesn't lie, that's why I'm baffled. Arana sells so many of those things, and as I mentioned, the T50 fit perfectly. Ugh. At least I likely won't have to remove that bolt again anytime soon...

I was baffled too I never would have checked a T50.
Thank you, T50 does fit perfectly in the tailgate latch bolt. I have updated the thread and post #1
Pictures and video in post #85
Here's a picture of the Arana gate damper kit I now see why their tool has a hole in it .

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[First Sergeant]

Since we're both baffled.
I know it's a lot to ask.
I'd really like to see a picture of the T50 bit you used in the bolt.
I can't believe that they'd be so far off.
Here's a picture of the Arana gate damper kit I now see why their tool has a hole in it .

Is it possible Ford ran out of TP 50's and put in T50's? Threads and pitch, everything else is the same I assume?

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

Is it possible Ford ran out of TP 50's and put in T50's? Threads and pitch, everything else is the same I assume?

I doubt it, I just checked and I'm in the process of updating the T50 fits perfectly as does the TP 45.
I checked the smaller bolts on the tailgate and they all still align with the Torx Plus bits.
I Thank "Mavi-ous" for pointing this out.

 

[First Sergeant]

I doubt it, I just checked and I'm in the process of updating the T50 fits perfectly as does the TP 45.
I checked the smaller bolts on the tailgate and they all still align with the Torx Plus bits.
I Thank "Mavi-ous" for pointing this out.

Yes, that is strange, but they both work. I just went and looked at my tailgate and the bolt looks to me to be TP45. My T50 fits perfect! I can't find my Torx Plus set, but when I do I will try the TP45 on it also. EDIT: Maybe my eyes are crossed. I did a "relook", now it looks like a T50 bolt? Geez, this old thing is getting ridiculous, haha.

 

[sajohnson]

Possibly it's just a happy coincidence that a T50 also works -- like how some standard and metric sockets are almost exactly the same size?

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

Possibly it's just a happy coincidence that a T50 also works -- like how some standard and metric sockets are almost exactly the same size?

Exactly.

Yes, that is strange, but they both work. I just went and looked at my tailgate and the bolt looks to me to be TP45. My T50 fits perfect! I can't find my Torx Plus set, but when I do I will try the TP45 on it also.

Like I Updated in post #1 Some of the metric sizes closely overlap the SAE sizes 8mm (5/16"), 10mm (3/8"), 13mm (1/2"), 16mm (5/8"), 17mm (11/16"), and 19mm (3/4").
I never really thought about Torx
and Torx PLUS overlapping until @Mavi-ous mentioned it.

 

[mkebikecop]

Northern Tool + Equipment Store have them in stock

 

[sajohnson]

Now I'm wondering whether the screws for the lower front bumper trim > skid/bash plate on our BS Badlands are Torx Plus.

I just finished changing the oil, which involves removing the skid plate. That requires removing the 4 screws that hold the plastic trim to the skid plate. They are Torx. I noticed that a T27 came closest to fitting, but was kinda loose. I'd noticed that before but was not aware of Torx+.

<Later> The TP27 bit fit perfectly, no slop.

 

[dochawk]

I’m waiting til they come out with Torx ++

Torx++ is what you get when the wrench-heads and computer nerds spend too much time together . . .

Similar issue with regular Phillips screwdrivers on many Japanese marques; you need JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) or the heads strip out.

Simple solution: don't by Japanese cars!


(ok, so I have a 2006 Miata GT. But ford owned something like 30% of Mazda at the time, and I expected them to buy the other 70%. They shared parts [if nothing else, you can tell by the idiotic turn signal lever that is clearly ford derived and borderline unusable]. On the bright side, I can replace the engine, which failed at 60k and the rebuild at 70k, with a ford 2.5, which is the same engine as the Mazda 2.0 but built harder)

That way I don't have to have my credit card on file with PayPal, Home Depot or Lowe's..etc. I call it limited exposure or I my case ZERO EXPOSURE.

At the moment, I seem to get a total of 13.5% back from Lowes on regular priced stuff: 10% military discount, 2% from my fidelity or navy federal visa, and 1.5% on Lowes rewards or whatever it's called. I don't think I get that last 1.5% from Home Depot. If it's on sale, it drops to 6.5%, as 5% on the Lowes card and 1.5% rewards. That's pretty large compared to the risks.

I had job.
It interfered with my free time.

Yeah, that.

When I realized that I just plain wasn't interested in taking cases that didn't blink at my hourly rate ($475/hour), it was clearly time to fully retire.

A $25k fee won't change my life--but a '26 Cadillac sure would! (and, no, I don't mean a 2026!!!)

Still, only credit cards allow users to dispute charges,

There's some ability on debit, but it doesn't compare.

A few years, I noticed preauthorizations on a debit card that I didn't use. I called the fraud unit, and they couldn't do anything until a charge went through!

It turned out that there was a third debit card on the account, which had the logo of the football team of a former problem employee.

hmm.

Ok, fine. But is there an 8-point set yet?!

bah.

I'm going t beat the rush, and just 3D print both 10 and 12 point!

(cue links to the Onion article about a 5 blade razor, to mock the 4 blade that had just come out--which eventually happened [says the guy who never got a passable shave that would last the morning until the twin blades, and never a good shave until three blades--yet wears a beard])

I have a socket with about 500 pins which will individually depress and fit damn near anything. I just looked for it, cannot find it, think someone borrowed it..... Dang it!!!!

I regret to inform you that it was the Research Team.

You now need to not only replace it, but also buy the completely incompatible 501 pin successor model.

That was a great idea, taping them there. Unless you're old and forget

I've never had to buy a new tool because I couldn't figure out how I'd stored/filed it, and then found it when I put the new one away. Nope, never. Not me.

 

[kevinmccune]

Possibly it's just a happy coincidence that a T50 also works -- like how some standard and metric sockets are almost exactly the same size?

19mm and 3/4?

 

[BearyArizona]

To take the bolts out in the bed and install a molle panel back there, not only did I need the TORX +, I needed a damn impact driver! And that was only 1.5 years from picking it up! I can't imagine how seized those bolts are going to be years down the road...

 

[sajohnson]

Torx++ is what you get when the wrench-heads and computer nerds spend too much time together . . .

At the moment, I seem to get a total of 13.5% back from Lowes on regular priced stuff: 10% military discount, 2% from my fidelity or navy federal visa, and 1.5% on Lowes rewards or whatever it's called. I don't think I get that last 1.5% from Home Depot. If it's on sale, it drops to 6.5%, as 5% on the Lowes card and 1.5% rewards. That's pretty large compared to the risks.

Glen mentioned having card(s) on file. That is a bit more risky than using them for isolated purchases (if that's what you do). Still, there really is essentially zero risk with credit cards. The maximum liability for unauthorized charges is $50 -- and that is almost never charged, unless the owner fails to report a lost card.

So as you said, it's absolutely worth using your card(s) to get those discounts.

There's some ability [to dispute charges] on debit, but it doesn't compare.

A few years, I noticed preauthorizations on a debit card that I didn't use. I called the fraud unit, and they couldn't do anything until a charge went through!

It turned out that there was a third debit card on the account, which had the logo of the football team of a former problem employee.

hmm.

That's a huge disadvantage. Not to mention that if a thief does successfully steal some money, it comes from the card holder's checking acct -- not the bank.

I just Googled "reasons to use a debit card instead of a credit card." Most boil down to debit cards being a better choice for people who are likely to get into trouble with a credit card(s). That's a very real risk for many people, but for those with enough restraint, credit cards offer many advantages.

For example, banks offer rebates on purchases. They know that many customers will end up getting trapped paying interest, but those who pay the bill in full every month can take advantage of the banks cynical rebate program. Ours is 2% on all purchases, with no exceptions, and no annual fee. It adds up to ~$500/year.

 

[MakinDoForNow]

Glen mentioned having card(s) on file. That is a bit more risky than using them for isolated purchases (if that's what you do). Still, there really is essentially zero risk with credit cards. The maximum liability for unauthorized charges is $50 -- and that is almost never charged, unless the owner fails to report a lost card.

So as you said, it's absolutely worth using your card(s) to get those discounts.



That's a huge disadvantage. Not to mention that if a thief does successfully steal some money, it come from the card holder's checking acct -- not the bank.

I just Googled "reasons to use a debit card instead of a credit card." Most boil down to debit cards being a better choice for people who are likely to get into trouble with a credit card(s). That's a very real risk for many people, but for those with enough restraint, credit cards offer many advantages.

For example, banks offer rebates on purchases. They know that many customers will end up getting trapped paying interest, but those who pay the bill in full every month can take advantage of the banks cynical rebate program. Ours is 2% on all purchases, with no exceptions, and no annual fee. It adds up to ~$500/year.

It is amazing how much 2% cash back on a CC (5% on HEB in house branded groceries purchased on HEB grocery branded visa credit card) adds up to about $325/yr just on state farm cash back. Things like 2% + 10% senior discount on Whataburger meal help also. . Then have Costco brand visa card for larger discounts and cash back for using that particular card. When auto bank deposits happen, I log in and pay CC with nearest due date any surplus over $2500 checking balance goes to fidelity account. If auto deposit is not enough then transfer from Fidelity happens.

 

[First Sergeant]

Glen mentioned having card(s) on file. That is a bit more risky than using them for isolated purchases (if that's what you do). Still, there really is essentially zero risk with credit cards. The maximum liability for unauthorized charges is $50 -- and that is almost never charged, unless the owner fails to report a lost card.

So as you said, it's absolutely worth using your card(s) to get those discounts.



That's a huge disadvantage. Not to mention that if a thief does successfully steal some money, it come from the card holder's checking acct -- not the bank.

I just Googled "reasons to use a debit card instead of a credit card." Most boil down to debit cards being a better choice for people who are likely to get into trouble with a credit card(s). That's a very real risk for many people, but for those with enough restraint, credit cards offer many advantages.

For example, banks offer rebates on purchases. They know that many customers will end up getting trapped paying interest, but those who pay the bill in full every month can take advantage of the banks cynical rebate program. Ours is 2% on all purchases, with no exceptions, and no annual fee. It adds up to ~$500/year.

You are correct with reference to paying in full every month. Wife and i (married 52 years) have been debt free since we were 57, including no house payments. We use Costco Visa and get back $600-$700 every year for a long time and make sure to pay it off in full monthly. Me thinks Visa folks, they don't like us to much, but hey, Visa makes a little on the back end, charging Costco a percentage (.04%) of each sale. The industry average for other businesses is 1.5-3.5%. The nice deal between them is because Costco doesn't allow any other cards. We buy pretty much everything we can (and need) from them, including gas. For those interested, I like my Costco stock also. Expensive now, but still pays very well and doing pretty good most of the time.

 

[sajohnson]

It is amazing how much 2% cash back on a CC (5% on HEB in house branded groceries purchased on HEB grocery branded visa credit card) adds up to about $325/yr just on state farm cash back. Things like 2% + 10% senior discount on Whataburger meal help also. . Then have Costco brand visa card for larger discounts and cash back for using that particular card. When auto bank deposits happen, I log in and pay CC with nearest due date any surplus over $2500 checking balance goes to fidelity account. If auto deposit is not enough then transfer from Fidelity happens.

After being members for >20 years and always paying our Costco Citi Visa balance in full every month, my wife accidentally transposed 2 digits and under paid an $1,870 bill by $3(!). Citi Bank said, "GOTCHA!" and charged us 5,000% interest! 5,000% was the actual amount when the interest charges were applied to only the $3 we owed. You'd think there'd be some "goodwill assistance." Nope. I had to make 5-6 phone calls before finally getting a refund.

That's when I got a Wells Fargo 'Active Cash' Visa card. Costco accepts all Visa cards, and the Wells Fargo card pays the same 2% rebate, so we're breaking even on that.

I was going to cancel the Costco Citi Visa, but a) it's our Costco ID (you can get a separate ID though), and b) apparently canceling a credit card account -- especially one over 20 years old -- is bad for your credit rating. So I've reluctantly kept it.

We do the same with excess checking account money -- it goes to a Vanguard MM fund that's been paying about 4.5% -- a lot better than Capital One's 0.0001%.

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