Salespeople “fiction” add yours here

[SuperDave71]

You save $1000 a month on gas? What were you driving before, a tanker?
Even if you are doubling your mpg that's probably a ton of miles per month. My brain can't calculate all that at the moment but methinks a little exaggeration?

I do field service work. I was driving and still have a 2020 F350 diesel. My average calculated lifetime fuel economy (in the SD) is 19.0mpg. I drive roughy 60k miles a year.

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[SLINGSHOT]

When I ordered mine last September, my salesman told me it would be here in January. I told him the winter snow would come and melt and the grass would be green, and it still wouldn't be here.
We'll see who was right.

 

[Micheal]

So you don't have a problem with dealers who are just car flippers, but use lobbying and laws to protect their scummy business model, but you really don't like the average person that gets a lucky one in a lifetime chance to sell a couple vehicles over what they paid for it?

Exactly! Dealers aren't flippers, they are just business people selling a product. People who ordered multiple trucks, just to flip them are just greedy and cause others to wait or not get their trucks. Dealers pay B&O taxes, property taxes, provide jobs for the local community. Flippers gouge unsuspecting buyers who could get the truck cheaper if they had ordered sooner, or can wait for an ordered truck. They aren't paying any business taxes and such. Its not Carmax that will get them, but Karma!

 

[gringojames]

Because MSRP is full retail price. Paying more than the full retail price on a depreciating asset at the top of the market does not compute to people who aren't okay accepting the full purchase price with markup as a sunk cost... And those who don't like to pay more than a fair, reasonable price.

"retail" at the end of the day is theoretical. Free market will do what free market will do. I paid considerably over MSRP, because I needed a truck NOW, am I happy about it? Well, I've gotten it, so I can live with it.

I manage a business unit, and if times are slow, I'll sell things at a loss sometimes, because I'd rather lose money on project costs than spend money on recruiting, training and fixing mistakes if I can't keep my guys working. I don't necessarily like it, but at the end of the day, the price of anything is what 2 (usually) people are willing to each respectively buy and sell for. Supply and demand.

 

[FromAway]

Exactly! Dealers aren't flippers, they are just business people selling a product. People who ordered multiple trucks, just to flip them are just greedy and cause others to wait or not get their trucks. Dealers pay B&O taxes, property taxes, provide jobs for the local community. Flippers gouge unsuspecting buyers who could get the truck cheaper if they had ordered sooner, or can wait for an ordered truck. They aren't paying any business taxes and such. Its not Carmax that will get them, but Karma!

No, new car dealers are literally flipping cars, but with special protections from years of lobbying the government to avoid the same taxes that individuals would have to pay. They get to avoid all the fees when transferring ownership between Ford and the dealer, which all these "flipper" paid when they bought it. They also get to write off all their expenses. A private individual has to pay capital gains on any amount higher than what they bought the car for. They pay 20% on a short term gain like a car sale in Federal taxes, plus any applicable state or local taxes. Unless they form a business, they can not write off any of their expenses related to this gain. All the same sales taxes and property taxes apply to individuals as well. Providing jobs is not anyone's responsibility. They are simply middlemen that either take away profit from the seller or make the vehicle more expensive for the consumer. Dealers are marking up new vehicles as well, but you seem to only have a problem with anyone else making money? It is a very rare time in history where it is even possible for an individual to do so. At the end of the day both Ford and the dealer they bought it from were happy to make the deal to any private person flipping the vehicle. They could have put limits on how many vehicles and individual could buy. Only 3 states even have B&O taxes, which are simply passed onto the consumer anyway. No business takes a loss on taxes.

You are very likely a dealer or somehow benefit from the protected dealer business model, so please excuse me if I don't take your arguments seriously. You also seem to have no undestanding of the actual tax laws that govern individuals vs businesses. The only other industry that operates this way is real estate, but even that has private exceptions. And it is no coincidence that both industries are two of the biggest lobbying groups buying off politicians.

 

[Micheal]

You are so wrong in so many ways. Thanks for your input. I will now push the ignore button.

 

[FromAway]

You are so wrong in so many ways. Thanks for your input. I will now push the ignore button.

So you can't refute any of what I stated?

 

[JimParker256]

It IS a typical depreciating asset. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool. These have a VERY temporary inflated value. The flippers who got in early made out well. You made out well if your fuel savings is really that great. But you still paid WAY over value for a vehicle who's value is going to plunge. Anyone who paid that much over sticker and doesn't keep it until paid off has years of negative equity ahead.

Well, in that case, I should be OK since my MSRP+ADM Maverick was "paid off" before I left the dealer's lot...

 

[JimParker256]

I DO have a problem with flippers. I don't have any numbers, but just the amount of posts here regarding flippers is staggering. Think how many buyers are not getting their truck, or had to wait for extended periods of time, because some greedy flippers ordered 2 or 3, with the intention of flipping. I wish Ford had put a $5000 refundable deposit of these trucks.

I just don't see how a $5K refundable deposit would make any difference to a flipper... I'm not a flipper, but if I was, and could make $5K-$10K flipping a Maverick, why wouldn't I invest $5K for a year to do so? I'd be doubling my money, easily. That's better than the stock market, and better than the vast majority of alternative investments where the worst-case scenario is just walking away with the money you started with (refuse the order, and get your refundable deposit back).

Frankly, I doubt that even a "non-refundable" deposit would stop flippers. The profit potential is high enough that risk of just "breaking even" would be worth it for a lot of them... And I already know that "non-refundable" deposits would a non-starter for 99% of the legitimate buyers out there...

I'm really NOT suggesting tinkering with deposits to try to stop flipping – just pointing out that until you make it painful for people to walk away from an order, people will order trucks they don't necessarily want... So to that end, maybe it's the dealerships that do NOT require a deposit that are contributing to the "flipper" problem? (Said "tongue-in-cheek"...)

 

[jesemd]

Back to the salesperson fiction....I just remembered when we bought my wife's Toyota Venza, the salesman told us that if we ever, ever, ever put anything other than 87 octane in the tank, that the car would then come to expect that octane forever and we could never go back to 87 or it would ruin the engine. My wife, to this day, believes him more than me.

 

[ClemsonU88]

There are really 2 schools of thought here: Capitalism vs Christianity (or morality).

Capitalism is all about supply, demand, & maximum profit. If demand is low & supply is high, prices go down; if demand is high & supply is low, prices go up. If you don't like that, you don't like pure capitalism.

Christianity says (literally), "Do to others as you would have them do to you." If the guy in front of you buys the last 3 loaves of bread, just so he can resell them for an extra $2, is that good? It's legal, but is it good? Similarly, if someone buys an extra 3 Mavericks just to resell them for more and keeps 3 other people from ordering one exactly as they want/need it at MSRP, it's legal, but is it good? It doesn't really fit the "Do to others as you'd have them do to you" rule, does it? No one said being a Christian (or a good guy) was easy.

Dealers (unlike flippers) provide a service: traditionally, they have many vehicles on the lot for me to test drive & choose from and allow me to get a vehicle the day I want it. IMO, businesses that make a profit but still do to others as they'd want done to them are the best for our economy & culture.

 

[BuddyS]

See the post below yours. I work for a dealer and think the markups are BS. MSRP or below is what people have paid for decades. Due to extremely short new car volume dealers were somewhat forced to adjust. But the market is getting better for new car inventory and interest rates are now super high. Continuing to do dealer ADM or thousands of dollars for BS dealer installed accessories is purely gouging. It is bad business and consumers know this.

Agreed, and it's also their right to mark things up. But they reap what they sow... for every mark up sale they make they probably drive away 5 customers and put a little more tarnish on their reputation. It'd also be interesting to see how much service work dealers lose over the lifetime of a car because such a large percentage of buyers don't trust them and go to independent shops.

 

[vezpa]

Last year the ordering banks for Maverick were still open when they made the price increases. This year they are closed so why would they change the price on orders long ordered already?

 

[BuddyS]

Here's a question for you all... If you walked into a Ford Dealership and saw a $1.7M Ford GT on the showroom floor with a $150K markup, would you be upset? Would the dealer be justified? Should the dealer be able to maximize his profit or should the car go at MSRP to the first person in the door the day it rolled off the truck? Should the dealer be allowed to call its best customers to give them a heads-up of the arrival day?

I think a lot of people are upset because suddenly the laws of supply and demand are affecting them and something they want. We can't have it both ways.

https://www.autoweek.com/news/sports-cars/a42192256/ford-gt-mk-iv-final-edition/

 

[LM42]

Agreed, and it's also their right to mark things up. But they reap what they sow... for every mark up sale they make they probably drive away 5 customers and put a little more tarnish on their reputation. It'd also be interesting to see how much service work dealers lose over the lifetime of a car because such a large percentage of buyers don't trust them and go to independent shops.

I used to know the statistic for the lifetime value of a service client and have forgotten it. But it’s notable for sure

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