Pay-per-mile vs Gas Tax

[MakinDoForNow]

Reading this thread, like most, bring back memories. This today brought back the illegals 50 years ago that would drive on the shoulders. Someone, I don't remember who asked a fellow worker why he was doing that. The reply was "I cannot drive on the roads because I do not have a license"!!!

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[rmay635703]

Always remember in all circumstances changes to cheap simple tax systems is universally to make people pay more.

per mile will never save anyone money and will only increase taxes for everyone.

 

[Prickly Pear]

I was digging into the Washington state proposal to see if it was going to be equitable or not. The plan was to charge 2.5 cents per mile. With the current state tax set at 55.4 cents/gal, it works out to a car getting 22.16 miles per gallon would be paying exactly 2.5 cents/mile and would not have any money owed or rebated. If you have worse mileage, you would get a rebate from the state as you are paying more than your share. If you get better mileage you have to pony up. If you have an EV and don't drive much, you get a rebate. Hi mileage EV's or hybrids would have some make-up payments to get to the 2.5. We would get credit for any electrification fees which count to how much we have paid in.
I think this is pretty fair, as everyone has to pay for what they drive.

 

[Timothyd]

Here in Washington they are proposing to replace state gas tax with a pay-per-mile charge. Claim the EV's and to a lesser extent hybrids are not paying their fare share of the road tax. Supposedly Oregon and three other states have some sort of pay-per-mile program. If you are in one of these states I'd like to hear how it is working out for you. If not, any general comments? In the example I saw if you even average 25 MPG you will pay more with the new plan than you do with Washington's gas tax. There is also talk of just charging hybrids more to register per year. I remember when you were encouraged to drive a car that was good on gas.....

Here in Illinois we need a head tax on liars(lawyers).

 

[Suzukiridr14]

Here in Washington they are proposing to replace state gas tax with a pay-per-mile charge. Claim the EV's and to a lesser extent hybrids are not paying their fare share of the road tax. Supposedly Oregon and three other states have some sort of pay-per-mile program. If you are in one of these states I'd like to hear how it is working out for you. If not, any general comments? In the example I saw if you even average 25 MPG you will pay more with the new plan than you do with Washington's gas tax. There is also talk of just charging hybrids more to register per year. I remember when you were encouraged to drive a car that was good on gas.....

I feel this would be a fair way to pay for road repairs, and maintenance. I only drive 3 to 4K a year (I'm old, and retired). The more you use the roads, the more you should pay. Whether you have an EV, use no gas, a hybrid, good gas mileage, or a guzzler, makes no difference, so to keep it fair, pay by the mile!

 

[Mudduck]

S.Dakota and i think Montana have open registration. That's a work around (for now). I use a PO box in my state. I change my PO box based on what counties have the cheapest insurance and go from there.
While you normally cant use a PO box for a DL, you can use the street address and then #xxx for your PO box and get your DL there with no issues. Been doing this for 15 years.

Some may think its cheating, I prefer to call it being "Thrifty". Is it the right thing to do? No. But everyone here is overcharged and taxed to the gill. I have to save as many pennies as I can and hope some of the dollars take care of themselves.

And there is also these. This is one example of a hundred. https://mileagestopper.com/

 

[Suzukiridr14]

The more I read, the more problems with a cost per mile theory bring up. It seems the problem is with EV's that don't use gas. All other drivers are paying for using the roads. People who sell their vehicles before re-registering would be hard to track down to collect the fees etc. EV's are all new vehicles that the mileage can be tracked, and recorded whenever the vehicle is registered. (must list mileage on new title) if sold to new owner. Each state will have to figure out what works for them.

 

[Tom 71 Maverick 24]

Pay per mile is just another government intrusion into people's ability to travel freely.

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

Do the Amish pay road taxes??
They seem to travel pretty freely, buggy, foot scooters, walking....

 

[nekodan]

I think it would be fair to eliminate the gas tax. Then all vehicles, placed into a couple weight classes, would be taxed annually based on reported mileage. I think most insurance companies require an annual odometer photo already. So it’s not tracking where you went but just miles travelled. Might make sense to have it at a federal level for a baseline and states can choose their additional tax.

 

[Pointyears]

Pay per mile is just another government intrusion into people's ability to travel freely.

The Constitution guarantees the right to travel...so start walking.

 

[Mavster Mechanic]

What's wrong with taxing tires based upon that standard tread-life number?

Pay all the tax up front.
Politicians would love that.
Selling a car with newish tires adds value to the car.

Ruin a tire early - get your taxes pro-rated on the new one based on tread depth remaining.

 

[wax87]

Here in Washington they are proposing to replace state gas tax with a pay-per-mile charge. Claim the EV's and to a lesser extent hybrids are not paying their fare share of the road tax. Supposedly Oregon and three other states have some sort of pay-per-mile program. If you are in one of these states I'd like to hear how it is working out for you. If not, any general comments? In the example I saw if you even average 25 MPG you will pay more with the new plan than you do with Washington's gas tax. There is also talk of just charging hybrids more to register per year. I remember when you were encouraged to drive a car that was good on gas.....

I suspect that they would keep the gas tax and then add a milage tax as well

 

[wax87]

Whatever each state or government entity decides to do with taxation, rest assured it will seem unevenly applied. I fully agree with those who believe themselves being penalized for efficiency, especially onerous since it is advanced by government. I also fully agree with those not driving an EV who have lengthy commutes. In my home state (Minnesota) the DMV surcharges EV owners $75.00 annually upon renewal of their registration. Hybrid and plug-in hybird drive trains are exempt but an attempt was made in 2021 to raise that rate to $229 and extend it to plug-in hybrids and presumably electric motorcycles as well. There was also talk of indexing that rate to an inflation or price index.
At any rate, infrastructure and taxes to pay for it are both important, but so is not only what you spend of taxpayer dollars but how you spend them as well. This is something Minnesota is excellent at IMO... waste. For years we had a growing budget surplus which we were told could not be spent as it was considered a "rainy day" fund for a possible future downturn. Eventually it grew to about or in excess of $18 billion but somehow last year or the year before, the majority party and governor, with little or no input, spent it all in a matter of about two weeks. Poof, and its gone. On top of that, we are now facing a potential budget shortfall, had our taxes increased, and received a several hundred dollar "rebate" from the state that was so poorly worded that the IRS considered that rebate or refund as income. The irony of paying a tax on a tax.

It doesn't matter what or how you feel. As a threat, government always seems to punish public safety first in a budget crisis. If they need more funds, they will tax or surcharge their way into new funds. Like your county and the mil rate.... they will just raise the rate, actual property value notwithstanding.

"it will seem unevenly applied" from someone that has Khrushchev on his profile is very interesting

 

[Surly Old Bill]

When I look at it unemotionally and without thought to make my personal financial burden lower than everyone else, a mileage tax replacing a fuel tax makes the fairest argument.
Pay to play.

A formula to multiply vehicle weight by miles driven would be needed to make it more fair across the board. The mechanism to pay would have to be set up so it's not a lump sum. Perhaps an estimate based on the previous year, with monthly payments. It can be reconciled at the end of the year on income tax filings.

Plans to have an annual fee for EVs because drivers don't contribute through gas taxes seems logical, until you realize there are hydrogen, CNG, and other fueled vehicles, like those darn Amish. And of course the problem with some vehicles weighing a lot more or less (producing different amounts of road wear) paying the same flat rate. Thus, pay to play. The issue then will be that the gas tax won't be reduced because the fees have been shifted to mileage, there will just be additional taxes paid. And then used at the level of government efficiency; meaning that the roads will stay almost exactly the same despite a near doubling of fees supposedly paid to maintain the roads.

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