Battery Monitoring System, BMS, settings in ForeScan...

[23grayXLT84]

Is there anything wrong with just simply disconnecting both terminals, but leave the battery in the truck thus creating a true open circuit to the battery? I cannot imagine for the life of me there would be but assume nothing with these modern rolling computer vehicles. Lot easier on the back then lifting that bad boy out of the truck.

I forgot to check voltage today to see if anything changed from yesterday's reading of 12.16. I can live with that reading because losing A.S.S. is a non issue for me. Losing interior lighting and the app with remote start with winter in full mode here now is and will be an issue.

Gonna keep putzing with this, but some of this shit is above my pay grade. I am so hesitant to load for scan on my Win10 computer and boost the charge ceiling to 90%. Beside, I am not even confident that will do anything in the long term.

I'm suspecting, with no hard facts to back me up, that the culprit is that telemetry gizmo that feeds all our personal data to Ford. I would have no idea how to even investigate that or do anything about it.

If your willing to lose FordPass , uninstall it AND disable all connectivity setting from your head unit. You can go a step further and pull the TCU fuse. Try that for a week or two and see if anything changes.

I have been monitoring battery voltage and during short trips your BMS won't charge it back to your pre trip level. You need a long trip id say every 2~3 short ones.

My sample size is small but our other cars have zero issues with the same short trips and one is also a tech loaded 23... Dealers telling people to drive the trucks more is a pathetic excuse.

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[BlueSpec1]

Installed an AGM in the Maverick, as I'd done last year with my Escape.
Used a LN1AGM in the Maverick that fits the battery tray as it's the same size as the OEM BXT99RT4A.
The Escape has a BAGM48H6760 in place of its OEM BXT99RT4a.
I don't know if the few values FORscan lets you change has much affect on Ford's BMS program.

Since the BMS in the Ford vehicles seems to have problems going years back, I'll just watch & charge my batteries with a charger every couple of weeks and not depend on them getting charged properly by the vehicles.
Going to start watching them with FORscan Lite and a OBDLinkMX+.

I did a BMS reset once I had the AGM configured in FORscan.

Some of the FORscan screen shots.
FORscan's database looks like it changes with each release and the one I used last year on the Escape gave more battery types to choose from then the current version both for the Escape & the Maverick. FORscan's database also seems to be the reason for Incorrect Value or Not Configured for the Battery Tech/Type.
So I had to try using a battery Ah that's close to the LN1AGMs' 50Ah.

Escape's As Found with its OEM battery:
*I didn't have current FORscan version ready before I installed the LN1AGM, so didn't get Maverick's As Found.


FORscan BdyCM Config & Programming to change Battery SOC Target, Battery Type:






Maverick Ready to drive, parked and charging the AGM battery for first time:






BM2 Battery Monitor while Configuring & Maverick charging.


Escape PHEV trickle charging it's 12V battery with SOC 69%

 

[Skyline]

The optional factory 120VAC inverter might be a factor also. I know the 22 Ecoboosts with the inverter got a larger alternator.

This is the alternator on my Lariat Lux with inverter:

I believe that this is a 175 Amp alternator, but couldn't locate it on the web by part number.

Ugh, I hope to god the dashcam isn't pulling 200-400mA in parking mode (shock sensor not time-lapse).

The truck has started everytime even when it was -50C here for a few days. Though, I do carry a NOCO jump pack in case as well.

I'll take screenshots using Forscan for Windows when I got a moment to spare. Not entirely sure if it works correctly in setting the BMS target, which itself is a problematic.

Charging & diagnosing the battery is fairly frustrating. If you try to toss it on a charger after a drive, it thinks the battery is at a higher state of charge and it charges at a lower current.

Battery tested at 11.9-12V, 30% SoC, tossed it on a NOCO G7200 (older model). Showed 100% on the charger after an hour, tested at 60%, 12.2—12.4V (BA9 tester). The float charge makes it difficult to diagnose correctly, unless you leave it sitting for hours or run a bunch of electrical loads to bring the voltage down before testing.

Starting in -50 °C (-58 °F) is the ultimate test for the battery. Now, it gives me hope that mine will start in a breeze 20 - 25 °F...

In addition to the BMS, that sits on the negative battery post, all of the testing/charging may need to deal with the BCM (Battery Charging System), PCM (Power Control Module) and others. The communication between these modules and the modules by themselves could be messed up, that could also impact both the battery and the charging system. It's hard to troubleshoot when there are so many components for just the charging system. Changing the settings for just the BMS may not be sufficient, may need to change setting in the BCM as well. The PCM is probably not in the picture, that just sends a signal to the BCM to shut off charging the battery when the truck is accelerating. Unless it keeps sending the disable charging signal...

Thx for the Forescan images....

 

[Gullzway]

I am not inclined either and that is what stopping me from changing it. Although the lost time spent on figuring out what's wrong the the battery/charging system and visits to the dealer is not the best way to go.

Same here, 2.5hrs sitting at the dealership just to be denied a battery replacement, was enough for me to spend $180 on a Duralast Gold.

So far no deep sleeps, but it's only been about 4 months.

Still wondering if the battery type being set to AGM, as shown in forscan should be changed?

 

[Skyline]

If your willing to lose FordPass , uninstall it AND disable all connectivity setting from your head unit. You can go a step further and pull the TCU fuse. Try that for a week or two and see if anything changes.

I have been monitoring battery voltage and during short trips your BMS won't charge it back to your pre trip level. You need a long trip id say every 2~3 short ones.

My sample size is small but our other cars have zero issues with the same short trips and one is also a tech loaded 23... Dealers telling people to drive the trucks more is a pathetic excuse.

AFAIK, the TCM houses the AT&T SIM card. Pulling fuse # 11 supposedly disables all communication via cell networks. My truck has been running without the TCM module 9+ month without being missed. Kudos for the Ford engineers, who designed it this way. They probably didn't like the idea either. The smartphone app couldn't connect to the truck, after the TCM fused were out. Just keep in mind that the TCM can utilize the Wi-Fi connections as well, be that yours, or some free access wireless points. I am not certain that disabling the wireless connection would actually disable it.

Removing the leads and/or taking the battery out will have some side effects. the most obvious one is the time and the radio stations need to be reset. I also seem to recall that the engine/transmission controls will have a learning curve for adjusting the correct settings. There might be others, but don't recall...

It's not just the dealers, people in this forum advising the same, drive longer to maintain the battery. Living in a large town with minuscule public transportation, what are people supposed to do, drive to the town next next to them? Where I live, I can reach three towns within 2 - 3 miles. Some people have longer driveways than that....

 

[Skyline]

Still wondering if the battery type being set to AGM, as shown in forscan should be changed?

The more I looking into this issue, the more I believe that the BSM/BCM can do this once the new battery is evaluated by the two modules. After all, the new battery evaluation/testing can take eight hours. This is necessary to set the maximum charging voltage among other things. Why the system needs that long is beyond, when my tester detects the the type of battery, CCA, SoC, etc., within a minute that includes opening the hood...

 

[Skyline]

My truck was not used for two days, with cold days, night time lows in the mid to high 20s range. Checking the battery with the volt meter between the posts showed 12.17V, while the battery tester had a "better" idea:

A quick check between the +post and the ground had a "better" idea:

The fact that the same tester within a short period of time giving different values is confusing like hell. Just slammed the hood hoping it will start. Roughly an hour later, the truck started up with the FOB remotely, no problem. Driving to my destination the auto stop/start worked just fine to my surprise, despite the engine being warmed up just halfway. It had been the same on the way back with warm engine this time. That was even more confusing that the A.S.S. worked, that didn't two days ego. That may had been related to evaluating the battery and clearing things in the system.

I don't know, but from here on, I don't care; the system does whatever it wants anyway. At this point, it is doubtful that the battery dies in the winter and if it does, it'll be addressed at that time....

 

[Sagara]

My truck was not used for two days, with cold days, night time lows in the mid to high 20s range. Checking the battery with the volt meter between the posts showed 12.17V, while the battery tester had a "better" idea:

A quick check between the +post and the ground had a "better" idea:

The fact that the same tester within a short period of time giving different values is confusing like hell. Just slammed the hood hoping it will start. Roughly an hour later, the truck started up with the FOB remotely, no problem. Driving to my destination the auto stop/start worked just fine to my surprise, despite the engine being warmed up just halfway. It had been the same on the way back with warm engine this time. That was even more confusing that the A.S.S. worked, that didn't two days ego. That may had been related to evaluating the battery and clearing things in the system.

I don't know, but from here on, I don't care; the system does whatever it wants anyway. At this point, it is doubtful that the battery dies in the winter and if it does, it'll be addressed at that time....

Well I bit the bullet and bought an AGM battery from Costco, $300 Canadian after taxes. The BCM seems to be more happy with it as if you leave it overnight it might drop 5% in SoC (as per Forscan). Needs more testing/data.

Something to note. I've had the BCM set for a 95% target for a while now. All SoC percentages below are what Forscan states.

95% SoC Battery Target:

• With the old EFB battery, once it hits 88-90% SoC, the vehicle barely charges the battery -3A to 3/4A, it bounces so much it doesn't do much. A 15 min drive might get you 2-4% SoC increase.
• With the AGM battery, it appears the SoC increase in the approximate amount of driving gets you double the SoC return, 4-8%. The amperage being returned to the battery will drop to the same amount once you get to around 90%.
• Under the 95% target, the vehicle would trickle charge the battery once the vehicle came off the initial high idle.

120% SoC Battery Target (initial findings):

• AGM, out of curiosity I increased the SoC target to 120%, SoC before going to work was around 84%, when I adjusted the target SoC and checked it was around 70%, after sitting for 8 hours.
• However, what I did notice was unlike the previous setting, the vehicle was charging the battery at 10-20A from 70% up to 87-88% SoC. It then tapered off above 90%, but I was still getting 7-10A.
• Idling the vehicle for 10 mins, I was still getting double digit amperage output.

I'll have to do a more indepth look with a battery tester and compare. So far it has been an improvement. Time to collect more data from Forscan.

I do have some data recorded with Forscan that I'll have to compile into Excel when I get around to it.

 

[Skyline]

Well I bit the bullet and bought an AGM battery from Costco, $300 Canadian after taxes. The BCM seems to be more happy with it as if you leave it overnight it might drop 5% in SoC (as per Forscan). Needs more testing/data.

Something to note. I've had the BCM set for a 95% target for a while now. All SoC percentages below are what Forscan states.

95% SoC Battery Target:

• With the old EFB battery, once it hits 88-90% SoC, the vehicle barely charges the battery -3A to 3/4A, it bounces so much it doesn't do much. A 15 min drive might get you 2-4% SoC increase.
• With the AGM battery, it appears the SoC increase in the approximate amount of driving gets you double the SoC return, 4-8%. The amperage being returned to the battery will drop to the same amount once you get to around 90%.
• Under the 95% target, the vehicle would trickle charge the battery once the vehicle came off the initial high idle.

120% SoC Battery Target (initial findings):

• AGM, out of curiosity I increased the SoC target to 120%, SoC before going to work was around 84%, when I adjusted the target SoC and checked it was around 70%, after sitting for 8 hours.
• However, what I did notice was unlike the previous setting, the vehicle was charging the battery at 10-20A from 70% up to 87-88% SoC. It then tapered off above 90%, but I was still getting 7-10A.
• Idling the vehicle for 10 mins, I was still getting double digit amperage output.

I'll have to do a more indepth look with a battery tester and compare. So far it has been an improvement. Time to collect more data from Forscan.

I do have some data recorded with Forscan that I'll have to compile into Excel when I get around to it.

Interesting data, thx...

Can you include the Forescan settings in the spreadsheet? I probably won't go for the 120% SoC target, but will for 95%...

 

[Skyline]

Just FYI, Flooded cell and AGM have different charge voltages.
I double checked mine with Forscan and it is set to AGM and 80% charge.
If I had a problem I would change it, but I don't.


Interestingly, and I've never heard this before, but, this site says AGM's are best charged to 50%.

I have always read any lead acid battery is best kept at 100%. It seems more research is needed...

https://www.crownbattery.com/news/agm-vs-flooded-batteries-what-you-need-to-know

Makes me wonder if the truck is programmed to AGM and has a flooded, and that is why so many have low batteries??

Actually, this is what your link states about 50% charging, quote:

Users should take care when charging this battery as over, and under-charging can affect their life and performance. AGM batteries perform most reliably when limited to discharge no more than 50% of battery capacity.*

*-Emphasis mine...

 

[Automate]

Actually, this is what your link states about 50% charging, quote:

*-Emphasis mine...

Actually that is about how far to discharge, not how far to charge.

 

[MakinDoForNow]

The more I looking into this issue, the more I believe that the BSM/BCM can do this once the new battery is evaluated by the two modules. After all, the new battery evaluation/testing can take eight hours. This is necessary to set the maximum charging voltage among other things. Why the system needs that long is beyond, when my tester detects the the type of battery, CCA, SoC, etc., within a minute that includes opening the hood...

I read somewhere that (true or not I do not know) the bms 6-8 hour relearn procedure happens after the truck sits locked for six hours it will start to learn and then update the bcm and be through no later than 8 hours. (I assume that the six hours is to let the battery get reasonably close to the ambient temp so a 15 to 60 minutes test trickle can be measured to see how much charge battery will accept? Also I saw in a chart someone posted that there is a field for battery age or installation date (don't remember which). This date implies that the bcm can adjust the 100% charge target voltage based on battery days in service). Does anyone know if dealer updates this field when he installs a new battery? I suppose that the learn procedure could update that field if learn procedure noticed enough changes in battery condition to assume a battery was actually replaced?

 

[PlantMan]

I just replaced the EF battery in my 22 Ecoboost. I have a BM2 battery monitor directly on the battery terminals and after fully charging it would drop to 3-5V after just 48 hrs. I keep a jump box in the truck and sometimes after using it, the battery would then show 12.0 volts after turning the engine off. I got sick of dealing with the deep sleep/no start problem, so I got a replacement Optima yellow top 800 CCA AGM battery and hooked up a trickle charger cable. The BM2 only draws 1-1.5 mA and keeps a long history of battery voltage and transfers the data to the smartphone app.

 

[colinl]

I just replaced the EF battery in my 22 Ecoboost. I have a BM2 battery monitor directly on the battery terminals and after fully charging it would drop to 3-5V after just 48 hrs. I keep a jump box in the truck and sometimes after using it, the battery would then show 12.0 volts after turning the engine off. I got sick of dealing with the deep sleep/no start problem, so I got a replacement Optima yellow top 800 CCA AGM battery and hooked up a trickle charger cable. The BM2 only draws 1-1.5 mA and keeps a long history of battery voltage and transfers the data to the smartphone app.

clearly a bad factory battery. your dealership wouldn't replace it?

 

[Criss944]

I still has issues with either the battery, the charging system, or some gremlins I guess. The dealer was not much help, they've basically recharged the battery. That lasted about a week and now it's just as low on charge as previously. My repair shop tested the battery with the ESP800:

The battery is roughly 55 - 60% charged, based on this chart:

At this point I am lost what to do. It's a shame that my 18 years old Avalon is working just fine, no need to check anything on it. The Maverick on the other hand....

With the DCDC is capable of outputting up to 265 amps to the 12-volt battery, how long should it take to charge the battery from 11.8v to 12.6v?

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