When does the Hybrid Maverick use electric only vs. gas only vs. both?

[AutobahnSHO]

we often go downhill to our house, battery is usually pretty charged up. Sometimes when we go down hill out of the driveway ICE won't start up for several blocks.

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[Old Ford Guy]

Yeah, this is one of my burning questions about the hybrid. Sounds like there will never be a reason (reasonable reason, anyway) to have an aftermarket "pre-charger" to get the battery up to 70-100% before starting a drive. Just not enough range to be useful...ever really.

i've only had my '23 Laiat hybrid since late April, about 3k miles on it so far. this is my 1st hybrid so i am still getting acclimated to this powertrain system. i believe that the hybrid drive train as implemented in our Mav's is quite well executed IMHO.

for mostly city drivers it delivers outstanding mileage. and if you do more highway driving few non full electric vehicles available today get better mileage. i value not worrying about where the next working charger is a LOT. excluding the odd road trip once in a while i have gone from refueling once a wk, still working then to once a month!. of course your mileage will vary but thats a big deal for those of us on fixed or limited incomes or fleet operators as well.

i have noticed that the ICE will often kick in to charge the hybrid battery at what seems like random moments. my driveway is quite long and if i back all the way out depending on the starting HB charge level the ICE turns over sooner sometimes, especially if i hav'nt driven her in a few days.

on the flip side i have frequently managed mostly fully electric driving at speeds of around 60+mph for miles at a time once the HB (Hybrid Batt) has charge levels that the Master Control Unit decides conditions meet the pre programmed conditions that are appropriate for more electric power. i drive at least 90% in ECO mode FWIW.
it would appear that the engineers decided that the "optimal" operating HB charging state was around 50-70% was a good one. a little lower charge level, we should feed more juice o the HB, a higher charge level and the master control unit will utilize more HB assist. the driver has not much to do to keep the HB at its 'optimal' charge level for the system to operate as designed.
happy camper here so far.

 

[cowmeat]

I live in mildly hilly South Carolina and my commute is mostly truck routes with 60 mph speed limit. I use cruise control as often as possible, and on any flat stretch or slight downslope I click the cruise button down 2 mph quickly which will normally throw it into EV mode, then quickly click back up 2 mph to maintain speed. This method gets me a lot more EV usage out of the truck than it will do by itself.

 

[Montauk]

THE TORQUE for reverse only comes from the electric traction motor. But since you also have a generator on board you can drive in reverse for as long as you have gasoline on board.

FWIW at 25 mph and under you can drive 3.3 miles on level ground, on a "full" battery. Full = 70%. But that 70% almost never occurs. As stated above, the battery is usually about "half" changed.

Therefore a reasonable expectation is about 1.6 miles of travel at 25 mph from battery power alone. The gas comes on every time the battery hits 30%.

Some things are just good to know. This is one of them. But I needed an external meter to know when my battery was at 70%.

Is there a thread on the external meter you use, or is it the data logger I’ve seen posted on.

 

[MakinDoForNow]

we often go downhill to our house, battery is usually pretty charged up. Sometimes when we go down hill out of the driveway ICE won't start up for several blocks.

This implies that at least at some ambient temp (70-85-90°F?) the ice asap warm up to heat catalytic converter is not considered mandatory.

 

[DScruggs]

Do any of the well versed in hybrid tech have a good understanding of when my new hybrid uses electric vs gas versus both? It seems obvious at 1st glace but I have noticed if I back out the drive and very slowly drive it will initially say "all electric" . Somewhere in the computer a decision is made to eventually start using gas. Of course acceleration is a factor but I am sure there is much more. This is not a complaint but just curiosity about the mix of gas/ electric usage in day to day driving from a tech point of view.

Hi,

I have worked on hybrids quite a bit and I can help a little. Somewhere in this thread is a link to a good video about how they work. The system used in the Maverick (and the Escape) eCVT transmission is a two motor transmission. One as primary motive power and one as regen and as a "holding" motor.

Note: Motor = Electric and Engine = Gas for the purpose here.

I have also seen several misconception posted here. One person seemed to think that that gas engine only recharges the battery. Absolutely false. Also, some seem to think there are three modes (electric only, both gas and electric, and gas only). Understandable but wrong. There is no gas only mode. Electric ONLY or both working together are the two modes.

The person that stated that the hybrid battery is normally kept near 50% charge is spot on correct. So are his reasons.

As for your direct question, the system "seems" to default to electric only when possible.

• At some point the battery is depleted such that this is no longer possible OR
• Demand for acceleration exceeds the battery's capability to provide.

In both cases the gas engine is started via the "holding" motor. This is generally seamless. The gas engine ABSOLUTELY provides motive power to the wheels. The "holding" motor acts similar to a sprag or one-way clutch to allow the power from the engine to be transmitted through the planetary to the wheels.

Hope this helps.

Don

 

[dochawk]

We needed powerful computers to make it all practical.

I think that's a bit of an overstatement, but not huge.

With solid state electronics, the most basic parts--but those that yield the bulk of the results--could be largely done. Simple logic to prevent regeneration when the battery is too full, and to cut out attempted electric motor use when too low.

Digital computers let us get noticeably more, but the bulk of the gains from the hybrid come from regenerative braking turning into starting again from the next stop. More battery capacity than needed for holding a couple of restarts leads to diminishing returns.

Analog processing would let us get some benefits by running the engine harder under load so as to grab more, but would greatly benefit from the more sophisticated profile available to a digital processor working with a profile. Similarly, but to a lesser extent, as to supplementing ice power with electric.

anyway, had the gains been enough given fuel prices at the time, much, but far from all, of the benefits could have been done with analog computers, and more (but not all) of the gain with 8 bit processors and 1980s technology.

 

[Timothyd]

Do any of the well versed in hybrid tech have a good understanding of when my new hybrid uses electric vs gas versus both? It seems obvious at 1st glace but I have noticed if I back out the drive and very slowly drive it will initially say "all electric" . Somewhere in the computer a decision is made to eventually start using gas. Of course acceleration is a factor but I am sure there is much more. This is not a complaint but just curiosity about the mix of gas/ electric usage in day to day driving from a tech point of view.

It's load dependent and battery charge dependent. And, reverse is always battery.

 

[dochawk]

It's load dependent and battery charge dependent. And, reverse is always battery.

almost always.

If there's other enough battery to do it, it turns on the ice to generate current for the electric motor.

this allows a serious reduction of transmission complexity!

 

[Timothyd]

almost always.

If there's other enough battery to do it, it turns on the ice to generate current for the electric motor.

this allows a serious reduction of transmission complexity!

Okay, I've never had the engine turn on for reverse. I was wondering what would happen with a dead battery.

 

[The Real Maverick]

There are times the truck runs essentially on gasoline only. But it is uncommon.

At around 55 mph, under light loads, the generator is not spinning, and zero watts come or go from the battery. The engine RPM and wheel RPM are in perfect ratio.

There seems to be this perfect "homeostasis" point. Rare. And you need extra instrumentation to see it happen. But it does happen.

 

[AutobahnSHO]

I think that's a bit of an overstatement, but not huge.

With solid state electronics, the most basic parts--but those that yield the bulk of the results--could be largely done. Simple logic to prevent regeneration when the battery is too full, and to cut out attempted electric motor use when too low.

Digital computers let us get noticeably more, but the bulk of the gains from the hybrid come from regenerative braking turning into starting again from the next stop. More battery capacity than needed for holding a couple of restarts leads to diminishing returns.

Analog processing would let us get some benefits by running the engine harder under load so as to grab more, but would greatly benefit from the more sophisticated profile available to a digital processor working with a profile. Similarly, but to a lesser extent, as to supplementing ice power with electric.

anyway, had the gains been enough given fuel prices at the time, much, but far from all, of the benefits could have been done with analog computers, and more (but not all) of the gain with 8 bit processors and 1980s technology.

ALL electric motors are more efficient with a computer super quickly measuring and adjusting voltage. There are videos about how the hybrids literally do it (hundreds?) of times per second-

Analog controllers just wouldn't be able to manage the electric powertrain not to mention balancing the 2 motors plus complex ICE together.

 

[jphaymond]

Do any of the well versed in hybrid tech have a good understanding of when my new hybrid uses electric vs gas versus both? It seems obvious at 1st glace but I have noticed if I back out the drive and very slowly drive it will initially say "all electric" . Somewhere in the computer a decision is made to eventually start using gas. Of course acceleration is a factor but I am sure there is much more. This is not a complaint but just curiosity about the mix of gas/ electric usage in day to day driving from a tech point of view.

This is a good explanation.

 

[DScruggs]

This is a good explanation.

Amen! All of the Weber State auto tech videos are great!

 

[GearGuy]

I haven’t seen it mentioned in this thread but if I have the power meter enabled on my 2025 and I’m moving forward, from memory, a light blue/aqua band will show at the bottom of the power column to indicate the proportion of electric contribution in hybrid mode. Not sure if this shows for other model years?

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