TFL Slip Test on 2025 Maverick Hybrid AWD

[colinl]

I think it's likely the Maverick system is tuned differently. The hybrid is going to have some prioritization for fuel economy, and the system is going to take into account the fact that it's a truck and needs to send traction to the rear during weight transfer. I think "off road" performance was a distant third. That's not to say I'm happy about the result, as I think Ford can do better.

does the Lariat have a 4WD-Lock mode?

I believe only the Tremor has that and I'm certain it's because it has a liquid cooled PTU. (pics of it over here)

but I do recall reading (or seeing a video) at Lobo launch that it has a liquid cooled PTU also.

interestingly, I decided to peruse the 2025 owner's manual and saw this.

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[Nw_adventure]

We were going to order a 2025 Lariat AWD Hybrid with the 4k towing. NOT NOW.

After seeing the TFL slip-test and the "nothing more and a camp/fishing site" test ... and the FACT the Maverick AWD Hybrid can't un-stick itself on a "slippery" road (e.g., two wheel off the road on snow or ice) ... or getting up an off-camber road in snow-ice ... just after the plow (super slick, if one does not know), etc ... then the AWD isn't what it MUST be to pay $40,000. Sorry FORD.

LOOK at the Subaru Forester ... HAS open front and rear diffs ... and it goes UP a steep sandy hill.
Sarah-N-Tuned ... was able to drive the 2025 Forester on dirt with ... as EXPECTED AWD ability.



TFL ... seems Subaru doesn't like them, yet they borrowed a customers 2023 ... and did the same roller slip-test and the same camp/fishing site test ... and the 2023 Forester had no problems.



yes, I understand the Forester does not tow ... but its open diff AWD system sure performed better.

And, FORD knows this .... because at Michigan Proving Grounds ... one will SEE every vehicle there from other makes being tested. Then, the "lift reviews" ... engineers get invited to ... see and comment. In the Ford parking lots, plenty of Sabaru ... owned and driven by Ford employees.

We are NOT looking for ... or Expecting ... to "rock crawl" a Maverick ... but need High Sierra Nevada winter traction, and ... if ever go down some gravel or dirt ROAD (not trail) and there is a 'bad patch' ... and NOT get stuck. If one wheel is on the ground ... the brake-bias torque vectoring MUST stop the spinning wheel ... Else, one is back to a 1951 open diff Willy truck.

Ever get an idiot stop on a slick road in front of you? You'll be stuck. Road are slick, off camber, whatever ... has to be able to get going. The Maverick ... just sat there ... on the rollers. awful. Sad

One can get 'stuck' on the snow and ice "hills" in Ann Arbor ... two wheels off on the side.
Northville has some hills ... . On and ON ... Dearborn is level, but there are the two HILLS at Michigan Proving Grounds ... .

Have YOU seen the "truck" routes at Michigan proving grounds ? The maverick AWD will NOT go up the mini hills and routes ... based upon TFL's roller test ... or the dirt test.

Let's say ... been there, done that.

BTW, other CUVs TFL recently tested had NO problems on that "dirt test" !!! "cheap" CUVs better !!

If HONDA can make a unit-body truck (Ridgeline) with a clutch-pack rear diff and tow 5,000 pounds, then surely Ford can make a Maverick with one and tow 4,000 pounds.
Heck, use the GNK diff out of the Focus RS (almost exactly the Honda system, btw) ...
For the 2018 Focus RS, Ford added the Quaife LSD to the front diff. With the updated Mountune gearbox ... there wasn't a faster car on a "back road, with hairpins ... . That might be possible on the Ecoboost transmission ... but maybe not the E-CVT (no belt).

TURNING OFF the traction control will NOT help ... stuck. (watch it AGAIN).

Mileage ... 29 versus 34 indicated ... is no excuse.

Ford, sadly, has too many "yes-men' getting bonuses to 'sign-off' and pass unacceptable product to production. Witnessed that too many times ... ... . Corporations.

==========

This is unacceptable.

FARLEY ... needs to wake-up ... rolls some heads. And take a HUGE pay CUT.

Soon ... these will be on lots ... collecting dust.

=========

Looking forward to a Sarah-N-Tuned test of a 2025 AWD Hybrid ... Lariat (vs XLT) ... but both have the same drivetrain. Want to see what Sarah says ... how it goes up her CUV hill, etc. How it drives on her "dirt rally stage" ...

TFL needs to get their hands on a 2025 AWD Ecoboost ... and TEST it ... slip and that "typical camp/fishing site dirt road" ... . Does the Ecoboost have a better brake-bias torque vectoring ?

SOFTWARE .... FARLEY ... software.

@ Ford Motor Company
======

More References:






========

READING IS REQUIRED

Driving sports TV- In an Off road stress test with the Maverick (AWD 2.0) and a Subaru (Adventure model, not sure) It definitely seemed like the Ford did a little better. Agree that it would be nice to see the AWD/ECO-Boost on the slip roller-

 

[npaladin2000]

So FX4/Tremor get a lock feature. How nice for them. I guess I get why, it's an "off road" feature.

The rear differential lock part has me curious though...so there's a button to essentially lock the rear wheels together and close the diff, at least electronically?

I believe only the Tremor has that and I'm certain it's because it has a liquid cooled PTU. (pics of it over here)

but I do recall reading (or seeing a video) at Lobo launch that it has a liquid cooled PTU also.

interestingly, I decided to peruse the 2025 owner's manual and saw this.

 

[colinl]

The rear differential lock part has me curious though...so there's a button to essentially lock the rear wheels together and close the diff, at least electronically?

that's also a lobo/tremor thing. they have a completely different RDU which was derived from the Focus RS. it is pretty crazy how it works, it's actually locked by default and it uses clutches to allow wheelspeed differences. I believe it has cooling fins and some Focus RS owners who drove on road courses reported issues overheating. but since it's locked by default, it actually would make sense that it would work great offroad. it needs to allow slip when turning, in fact it does this dynamically to assist in turning, but otherwise being locked is a great thing.

here's a video from 2017 about the Focus RS unit.

 

[colinl]

...and now perhaps more people can understand why the lobo and tremor are expensive.

it's hard not to take a dim view of ford removing fx4 from lariat for MY25, though. they want you in a tremor - which is fine if you're not towing. but if you want to tow 4k pounds and do a little light offroad, guess you're buying a xlt?

 

[dn325ci]

We were going to order a 2025 Lariat AWD Hybrid with the 4k towing. NOT NOW.

After seeing the TFL slip-test and the "nothing more and a camp/fishing site" test ... and the FACT the Maverick AWD Hybrid can't un-stick itself on a "slippery" road (e.g., two wheel off the road on snow or ice) ... or getting up an off-camber road in snow-ice ... just after the plow (super slick, if one does not know), etc ... then the AWD isn't what it MUST be to pay $40,000. Sorry FORD.

LOOK at the Subaru Forester ... HAS open front and rear diffs ... and it goes UP a steep sandy hill.
Sarah-N-Tuned ... was able to drive the 2025 Forester on dirt with ... as EXPECTED AWD ability.



TFL ... seems Subaru doesn't like them, yet they borrowed a customers 2023 ... and did the same roller slip-test and the same camp/fishing site test ... and the 2023 Forester had no problems.



yes, I understand the Forester does not tow ... but its open diff AWD system sure performed better.

And, FORD knows this .... because at Michigan Proving Grounds ... one will SEE every vehicle there from other makes being tested. Then, the "lift reviews" ... engineers get invited to ... see and comment. In the Ford parking lots, plenty of Sabaru ... owned and driven by Ford employees.

We are NOT looking for ... or Expecting ... to "rock crawl" a Maverick ... but need High Sierra Nevada winter traction, and ... if ever go down some gravel or dirt ROAD (not trail) and there is a 'bad patch' ... and NOT get stuck. If one wheel is on the ground ... the brake-bias torque vectoring MUST stop the spinning wheel ... Else, one is back to a 1951 open diff Willy truck.

Ever get an idiot stop on a slick road in front of you? You'll be stuck. Road are slick, off camber, whatever ... has to be able to get going. The Maverick ... just sat there ... on the rollers. awful. Sad

One can get 'stuck' on the snow and ice "hills" in Ann Arbor ... two wheels off on the side.
Northville has some hills ... . On and ON ... Dearborn is level, but there are the two HILLS at Michigan Proving Grounds ... .

Have YOU seen the "truck" routes at Michigan proving grounds ? The maverick AWD will NOT go up the mini hills and routes ... based upon TFL's roller test ... or the dirt test.

Let's say ... been there, done that.

BTW, other CUVs TFL recently tested had NO problems on that "dirt test" !!! "cheap" CUVs better !!

If HONDA can make a unit-body truck (Ridgeline) with a clutch-pack rear diff and tow 5,000 pounds, then surely Ford can make a Maverick with one and tow 4,000 pounds.
Heck, use the GNK diff out of the Focus RS (almost exactly the Honda system, btw) ...
For the 2018 Focus RS, Ford added the Quaife LSD to the front diff. With the updated Mountune gearbox ... there wasn't a faster car on a "back road, with hairpins ... . That might be possible on the Ecoboost transmission ... but maybe not the E-CVT (no belt).

TURNING OFF the traction control will NOT help ... stuck. (watch it AGAIN).

Mileage ... 29 versus 34 indicated ... is no excuse.

Ford, sadly, has too many "yes-men' getting bonuses to 'sign-off' and pass unacceptable product to production. Witnessed that too many times ... ... . Corporations.

==========

This is unacceptable.

FARLEY ... needs to wake-up ... rolls some heads. And take a HUGE pay CUT.

Soon ... these will be on lots ... collecting dust.

=========

Looking forward to a Sarah-N-Tuned test of a 2025 AWD Hybrid ... Lariat (vs XLT) ... but both have the same drivetrain. Want to see what Sarah says ... how it goes up her CUV hill, etc. How it drives on her "dirt rally stage" ...

TFL needs to get their hands on a 2025 AWD Ecoboost ... and TEST it ... slip and that "typical camp/fishing site dirt road" ... . Does the Ecoboost have a better brake-bias torque vectoring ?

SOFTWARE .... FARLEY ... software.

@ Ford Motor Company
======

More References:






========

READING IS REQUIRED

Wow, what a rant! I love my Maverick, but I'm here for your rant, bro.

A bit of hyperbole, but of course your underlying point is rooted in truth.

There is nothing wrong with Maverick's AWD that earlier application of the brake on the slipping wheel would not solve.

It's software.

 

[TheMaverickLife]

Caution ... more reading than a tweet:
===========================

The Honda AWD system:

https://hondanews.com/en-US/honda-a...3cdccc46490ec2fd-honda-i-vtm4-all-wheel-drive

Items of note:
- 27-29 mpg on freeway, w/tonneau
- 17.8 mpg towing ... approx 3,000 trailer (Futura & classic sports car), and equipment to about 4,000 pounds "payload" ... over the largest mountain gain (Donner Summit), Coastal steep hills, and 106-F valley temps.
- 27.5 mpg ... over Sierra Nevada, Tioga Pass (~ 10,000 feet) ... loaded w/gear.

Quaife
https://www.quaife.co.uk/

Focus RS
- 3 sets of tyres "used up" ... all track, rain to Thunderhill & Button Willow HEAT ... never any RDU issues (change the damn trans, PDU, RDU oil, dudes) ... . W/Quaife ... front torque steer virtually eliminated. Cannot drive to "full potential" on public roads. Electronically limited to 150 mph. Hairpin traction ... torque vectoring ... beyond belief. Kiddies, wear diapers.

==========

AWD ... must work for
THINK ... slippery (hard) surface ... slope, off-camber. NOT rocks and NO "trail" ... .

and TOW at least 4,000 pounds (i.e., the payload).

==========

Right now, only the Ridgeline ... does that ... albeit at a higher price.

- Ecoboost AWD ... $1,x00 optional Quaife (goes in front) ... gets off the "rollers"
- Hybrid AWD ... can a Quaife be added to the eCVT output diff section ??
- $1,x00 option.

==========

Yet, software tuning, using brake-bias torque vectoring ... on both front and rear axles ... as appears Subaru does ... via a "drive mode" ... Slippery/Snow.

=========

Read 'em and weep ... vote with one's wallet.

========

End.

 

[Nw_adventure]

...and now perhaps more people can understand why the lobo and tremor are expensive.

it's hard not to take a dim view of ford removing fx4 from lariat for MY25, though. they want you in a tremor - which is fine if you're not towing. but if you want to tow 4k pounds and do a little light offroad, guess you're buying a xlt?

Its just a shame the rear locker is seemingly impossible for Ford to offer on the Maverick with 4K tow -

 

[npaladin2000]

Caution ... more reading than a tweet:
===========================

The Honda AWD system:

https://hondanews.com/en-US/honda-a...3cdccc46490ec2fd-honda-i-vtm4-all-wheel-drive

Items of note:
- 27-29 mpg on freeway, w/tonneau
- 17.8 mpg towing ... approx 3,000 trailer (Futura & classic sports car), and equipment to about 4,000 pounds "payload" ... over the largest mountain gain (Donner Summit), Coastal steep hills, and 106-F valley temps.
- 27.5 mpg ... over Sierra Nevada, Tioga Pass (~ 10,000 feet) ... loaded w/gear.

Quaife
https://www.quaife.co.uk/

RS
- 3 sets of tyres "used up" ... all track, rain to Thunderhill & Button Willow HEAT ... never any RDU issues (change the damn trans, PDU, RDU oil, dudes) ... . W/Quaife ... front torque steer virtually eliminated. Cannot drive to "full potential" on public roads. Electronically limited to 150 mph. Hairpin traction ... torque vectoring ... beyond belief. Kiddies, wear diapers.

==========

AWD ... must work for
THINK ... slippery (hard) surface ... slope, off-camber. NOT rocks and NO "trail" ... .

and TOW at least 4,000 pounds (i.e., the payload).

==========

Right now, only the Ridgeline ... does that ... albeit at a higher price.

- Ecoboost AWD ... $1,x00 optional Quaife (goes in front) ... gets off the "rollers"
- Hybrid AWD ... can a Quaife be added to the eCVT output diff section ??
- $1,x00 option.

==========

Yet, software tuning, using brake-bias torque vectoring ... on both front and rear axles ... as appears Subaru does ... via a "drive mode" ... Slippery/Snow.

=========

Read 'em and weep ... vote with one's wallet.

========

End.

Bigger, more powerful vehicle. Not a bad vehicle at all (I was hoping Honda would make a hybrid version of the Ridgeline) but a size and class up from the Maverick.

Also...last I checked the only countries where the Maverick is available is in the US and Canada? I don't think Quaife is going to be offering Maverick parts just yet.

 

[colinl]

Its just a shame the rear locker is seemingly impossible for Ford to offer on the Maverick with 4K tow -

ford uses dana front and rear traditional lockers* and I'm not aware of them making any IRS units small enough for the maverick, but I could be wrong.

* a traditional locking differential has a sliding pin that mechanically locks two sides together, either left and right for rdu or front and rear for ptu. this is cheap and effective but cannot be used on dry pavement, offroad or winter conditions only.

guys, it's important to remember that the Maverick is built to a price point and Ford knows it's a unibody truck so we are never going to tow like a Ranger, and for the foreseeable future not going to get Tremor features in a hybrid. (someday, I bet there's a turbo hybrid, like the F150 powerboost.)

it's not even the only hybrid compact or midsize truck anymore, but the others are bigger, heavier and don't get the gas mileage so while it's a bit of a bummer to see the awd hybrid struggle when it looks like simply more aggressive brake-based traction control programming would help, the overall niches that the various Maverick trim levels fit into do make sense. and it's a LOT of niches, between xl fwd hybrid, lariat 4k tow awd hybrid, tremor, lobo... except that poke in the eye from deleting the lariat fx4.

 

[FreedomPenguin]

Its just a shame the rear locker is seemingly impossible for Ford to offer on the Maverick with 4K tow -

What benefit does that have to someone who just drives on road and maybe tows something every few years? Hopefully nothing to me

 

[Nw_adventure]

ford uses dana front and rear traditional lockers* and I'm not aware of them making any IRS units small enough for the maverick, but I could be wrong.

* a traditional locking differential has a sliding pin that mechanically locks two sides together, either left and right for rdu or front and rear for ptu. this is cheap and effective but cannot be used on dry pavement, offroad or winter conditions only.

guys, it's important to remember that the Maverick is built to a price point and Ford knows it's a unibody truck so we are never going to tow like a Ranger, and for the foreseeable future not going to get Tremor features in a hybrid. (someday, I bet there's a turbo hybrid, like the F150 powerboost.)

it's not even the only hybrid compact or midsize truck anymore, but the others are bigger, heavier and don't get the gas mileage so while it's a big of a bummer to see the awd hybrid struggle when it looks like simply more aggressive brake-based traction control programming would help, the overall niches that the various Maverick trim levels fit into do make sense. and it's a LOT of niches, between xl fwd hybrid, lariat 4k tow awd hybrid, tremor, lobo... except that poke in the eye from deleting the lariat fx4.

We can still dream though-

 

[Nw_adventure]

What benefit does that have to someone who just drives on road and maybe tows something every few years? Hopefully nothing to me

The benefit of being more capable off/road - and being more capable in off road situations while towing- I am ready to sign up. Those who stay on the road can enjoy life already in progress without needing to worry.

 

[TheMaverickLife]

The 2L ecoboots and trans ... are from the Focus ST and RS (PTU), so yes, a Quaife is available.

AS an OEM ... very "inexpensive" to add ... if even as an optional cost option.
A front LSD ... on the TFL "roller slip test" would make all the difference in the world.

================================

Will "someone" at FORD ... realize this ... and offer this as a 2026 option ?
- too late to add for 2025 Job3 .... if already designed and verified.

Just think ... if added for 2026 ... as an option ... all the "dudes" (almost always dudes, yeah?) will dump their 22-25 Mavericks and BUY the 2026. More profits, and free-up Mavericks for those "who only buy used" ... which makes the merry-go-round of the automotive industry work.

==============================

AWD, 4k towing, hybrid. NO getting "stuck" on pavement.

 

[FreedomPenguin]

Never been off road, don’t think I will ever take a vehicle off road lol. Too expensive of an item to seem to be fun.
I’ve owned snowmobiles and such, drop off at road and ride them through mountains. Never once left the side of road in any situation.

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