Dealer 10k service-- I got got, help me understand how badly

[GreasyLightening]

I know precious little about cars, but I'm trying to learn. I have a 2024 Maverick Hybrid with 9200 mi and I wanted to use my experience today as a learning experience if you would be so kind as to weigh in.

Today I went to the dealer for my 10k mile service. Oil change, tire rotation, checks, the usual. When I got there the guy mentioned that part of the 10k service is a Fuel/Air induction service. I was juggling a work meeting at the time and just said "yeah, ok". I didn't say "Um... at 10k miles?" or "I don't see that in the service plan in the app", just "ok". Ok, strike 1.

Then when it came time to square up I was in another meeting (lesson learned, next time I take the morning off) and so when he said it would be $424.01 I had some sticker shock but I paid and left. Strike 2.

When I got home and looked at the invoice I saw:

• A - Oil change, etc - $107.58
• B - Fuel/Air Induction Service - $261.95
• C - Multi point inspection - $0.00

Page 2 showed:

• Labor amount - $178.90
• Parts amount - $190.63
• Misc. charges - $32.20
• Total charges - $22.28
• Please pay - $424.01

I was also told that my brake pad thicknesses were 8, 8, 6, and 6. He said that in a few months I'll likely need to have the brake pads replaced to avoid wear on the rotors.

My questions:

1. Is there any universe where the Fuel/Air induction service was necessary, or was I 100% had?
2. Are those "Misc Charges" BS?
3. That level of brake pad wear on a hybrid with 9200 miles!? Aren't hybrids supposed to go upwards of 60k without brake changes? For reference 3k of those are long highway trips and the rest is primarily in-city highway driving (and my braking is usually between 90 and 100% according to brake coach). Am I being had here too?
4. How outraged should I be about all this?

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[todd92]

Upsell city...

 

[Carlitos_92]

The induction service was a money-grab and is pretty common. You 100% did not need it.

The misc. charges could've been a lot of things, but probably point to shop supplies that aren't "parts." Given the small amount, not worth fighting over, and most likely they charge everybody some misc. charges anyway.

You are right about the brakes; you aren't liable to need new pads for years. But you aren't "had" on that one yet since you haven't paid them money to replace them.

Lessons learned the hard way are the ones I'm least likely to forget. So chalk this all up to a learning experience and feel fortunate that you are financially able to absorb a flub here and there.

I'd say "find another dealer" but these tactics are widespread. You can educate yourself AHEAD of time if you go back there, though. Good luck.

 

[Meeka]

I know precious little about cars, but I'm trying to learn. I have a 2024 Maverick Hybrid with 9200 mi and I wanted to use my experience today as a learning experience if you would be so kind as to weigh in.

Today I went to the dealer for my 10k mile service. Oil change, tire rotation, checks, the usual. When I got there the guy mentioned that part of the 10k service is a Fuel/Air induction service. I was juggling a work meeting at the time and just said "yeah, ok". I didn't say "Um... at 10k miles?" or "I don't see that in the service plan in the app", just "ok". Ok, strike 1.

Then when it came time to square up I was in another meeting (lesson learned, next time I take the morning off) and so when he said it would be $424.01 I had some sticker shock but I paid and left. Strike 2.

When I got home and looked at the invoice I saw:

• A - Oil change, etc - $107.58
• B - Fuel/Air Induction Service - $261.95
• C - Multi point inspection - $0.00

Page 2 showed:

• Labor amount - $178.90
• Parts amount - $190.63
• Misc. charges - $32.20
• Total charges - $22.28
• Please pay - $424.01

I was also told that my brake pad thicknesses were 8, 8, 6, and 6. He said that in a few months I'll likely need to have the brake pads replaced to avoid wear on the rotors.

My questions:

1. Is there any universe where the Fuel/Air induction service was necessary, or was I 100% had?
2. Are those "Misc Charges" BS?
3. That level of brake pad wear on a hybrid with 9200 miles!? Aren't hybrids supposed to go upwards of 60k without brake changes? For reference 3k of those are long highway trips and the rest is primarily in-city highway driving (and my braking is usually between 90 and 100% according to brake coach). Am I being had here too?
4. How outraged should I be about all this?

I think they saw you on your phone with these ‘meetings’ and they said B.S. to you and you just kept saying O.K. Aha, we got him! Next time no meetings and ask them to explain WHY! Sorry for your bad experience tho.

 

[UTAlumnus]

I was also told that my brake pad thicknesses were 8, 8, 6, and 6. He said that in a few months I'll likely need to have the brake pads replaced to avoid wear on the rotors.

1. That level of brake pad wear on a hybrid with 9200 miles!? Aren't hybrids supposed to go upwards of 60k without brake changes? For reference 3k of those are long highway trips and the rest is primarily in-city highway driving (and my braking is usually between 90 and 100% according to brake coach). Am I being had here too?

I don't know the brake pad thicknesses but my 2006 Toyota Camry was at 130k miles on the original pads in 2022 when I traded it for the Maverick. The Toyota dealer checked them every 5k miles when the oil was changed. It was also on its original 12v battery.

 

[DaveVan]

Wow. Retail cost of the filter is $15 and $36 for the oil. I can see $100 for parts as a reasonable mark-up, but (IMO) $190 is in rip-off territory. The $32 most likely includes disposal fees for the old oil.

Could be worse. About four years ago I got a coupon in the mail from my local dealer for $60 oil change for my Honda CR-V. Hey, that's a not a bad deal! However, I ended up spending over $3,500 ($3,000 in labor) for a rear differential service, water pump, oil pressure switch, and spool valve & thermostat gaskets. Gee, they should have tossed in oil change for free; or at least bought me dinner.

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

I hope you at least got

Seriously, I'm sorry it happened
It's all in the details. Divided attention is never a good thing.
There were choices.
Tell Ford you'll have to get back to them when your meeting is over.
Excuse yourself from the meeting, in order to deal with Ford.
Or
Do exactly what you did.

It's happened to a lot of us, you live and learn. At least you got something of value and service from it.

 

[Chops]

I know precious little about cars, but I'm trying to learn. I have a 2024 Maverick Hybrid with 9200 mi and I wanted to use my experience today as a learning experience if you would be so kind as to weigh in.

Today I went to the dealer for my 10k mile service. Oil change, tire rotation, checks, the usual. When I got there the guy mentioned that part of the 10k service is a Fuel/Air induction service. I was juggling a work meeting at the time and just said "yeah, ok". I didn't say "Um... at 10k miles?" or "I don't see that in the service plan in the app", just "ok". Ok, strike 1.

Then when it came time to square up I was in another meeting (lesson learned, next time I take the morning off) and so when he said it would be $424.01 I had some sticker shock but I paid and left. Strike 2.

When I got home and looked at the invoice I saw:

• A - Oil change, etc - $107.58
• B - Fuel/Air Induction Service - $261.95
• C - Multi point inspection - $0.00

Page 2 showed:

• Labor amount - $178.90
• Parts amount - $190.63
• Misc. charges - $32.20
• Total charges - $22.28
• Please pay - $424.01

I was also told that my brake pad thicknesses were 8, 8, 6, and 6. He said that in a few months I'll likely need to have the brake pads replaced to avoid wear on the rotors.

My questions:

1. Is there any universe where the Fuel/Air induction service was necessary, or was I 100% had?
2. Are those "Misc Charges" BS?
3. That level of brake pad wear on a hybrid with 9200 miles!? Aren't hybrids supposed to go upwards of 60k without brake changes? For reference 3k of those are long highway trips and the rest is primarily in-city highway driving (and my braking is usually between 90 and 100% according to brake coach). Am I being had here too?
4. How outraged should I be about all this?

Waiting 10,000 miles for the first oil change could potentially gunk up your port injectors - so consider the fuel injection cleaning a preventative measure.

However, for your next 10,000 mile interval go to “Jiffy Lube” for an oil change only ($100?) at 15,000 miles and add a bottle of Techron or Motorcraft fuel injection cleaner ($35) to your gas tank at about 19,000 miles before your 20,000 dealer oil change only.

 

[Joe Strummer]

$424.01 = A + B + Misc Charges + Total Charges. Unfortunately you okayed A and B. The only charge you could dispute is "Total Charges" which I have no clue what it refers to.

10,000 miles for Fuel/Air Induction seems too early. Maybe worth checking whether this is a Ford recommendation or simply the Dealer.

Chalk it up to one of life's cruel lessons.

 

[710-oil-614]

You got touched up a little bit, yes.

Generally - I would avoid having any service done at the dealer that isn't warranty or recall work. Find a good local mechanic that you can trust and who is likely significantly more affordable than the dealership.

My local mechanic is generally 60-65% of what the dealer costs for the same services and also does not upsell and over recommend service and maintenance, only what you need to keep the vehicle operating properly OR following a manufacturers service schedule.

 

[Probity]

It's the way of the world now. The recommended brakes work in future part sounded pretty sketchy but without seeing them no absolute way to tell.

I've a mixed mind about induction cleaning services, I think it does have value under some conditions (DI-only engine, lots of short trip driving, many more thousands of miles on the odometer), but not even 10k miles on a naturally aspirated port fuel injection engine? That does not make a lot of sense unless you already had a rough idle, sluggish overall throttle response, misfires, etc. In a perfect world, the cost to borescope the intake would be minimal, and you could then decide for yourself if the condition warranted treatment. But I'll bet the cost of a borescope at a dealer would be in line with the cost of the induction service itself.

You will never find Ford Motor Company "recommending" that kind of chemical induction service work at x miles interval in any written form. Their dealers are not under that kind of constraint; it's probably more of a concern for them that the service doesn't cause any additional problem.

Last year Ford (Motorcraft) and BG 'partnered ( BG Products, Inc., and Motorcraft® Announce the Launch of the Motorcraft® BG Enhanced Chemical Maintenance Program – BG Products, Inc. ). What was metered into your intake probably was in a Motorcraft can, but a BG Chemicals product. You can see the generalize 'procedure' they used here: Ford 2.5L Hybrid Engines – BG Products, Inc.

People used to (and maybe still do) walnut shell blast their intakes. Gotta take the intake manifold off though ($). Is the chemical-only treatment you received as good at cleaning as walnut blasting? BG would probably say yes or likely, for me I'm not sure.

Here's an interesting blurb on walnut blasting - Walnut Shell Blasting – SPEED LOGIC. A CA company, work only on BMW's. Was surprised to see the service could be as low as $300 (including new intake manifold gasket). And the big plus being, you get to actually see before and after. But even they state:

"Walnut Shell Blasting involves "shooting" a mixture of compressed air and Walnut Shells into the Intake Ports to clean carbon deposits and buildup that occurs slowly over time on the Intake Valves. It is considered a scheduled maintenance service that is required only on Engines that have Fuel systems known as Direct Injection (or DI). Many vehicle makes and manufacturers have modern vehicles that are Direct Injection which would also require this cleaning at a specified interval, not just BMWs."

 

[jeffrol48197]

I know precious little about cars, but I'm trying to learn. I have a 2024 Maverick Hybrid with 9200 mi and I wanted to use my experience today as a learning experience if you would be so kind as to weigh in.

Today I went to the dealer for my 10k mile service. Oil change, tire rotation, checks, the usual. When I got there the guy mentioned that part of the 10k service is a Fuel/Air induction service. I was juggling a work meeting at the time and just said "yeah, ok". I didn't say "Um... at 10k miles?" or "I don't see that in the service plan in the app", just "ok". Ok, strike 1.

Then when it came time to square up I was in another meeting (lesson learned, next time I take the morning off) and so when he said it would be $424.01 I had some sticker shock but I paid and left. Strike 2.

When I got home and looked at the invoice I saw:

• A - Oil change, etc - $107.58
• B - Fuel/Air Induction Service - $261.95
• C - Multi point inspection - $0.00

Page 2 showed:

• Labor amount - $178.90
• Parts amount - $190.63
• Misc. charges - $32.20
• Total charges - $22.28
• Please pay - $424.01

I was also told that my brake pad thicknesses were 8, 8, 6, and 6. He said that in a few months I'll likely need to have the brake pads replaced to avoid wear on the rotors.

My questions:

1. Is there any universe where the Fuel/Air induction service was necessary, or was I 100% had?
2. Are those "Misc Charges" BS?
3. That level of brake pad wear on a hybrid with 9200 miles!? Aren't hybrids supposed to go upwards of 60k without brake changes? For reference 3k of those are long highway trips and the rest is primarily in-city highway driving (and my braking is usually between 90 and 100% according to brake coach). Am I being had here too?
4. How outraged should I be about all this?

Ford recommends air induction cleaning at 20k now - your vehicle is a hybrid and the engine only runs 50% of the time, so at the very earliest I would recommend at 30k, if not even 40k. My recommendation would be works package at 10k, works package and cabin filter at 20k, then works and check air filter and induction (if wanted) at 30k...He oversold you work, sorry to say...

 

[Meeka]

It's the way of the world now. The recommended brakes work in future part sounded pretty sketchy but without seeing them no absolute way to tell.

I've a mixed mind about induction cleaning services, I think it does have value under some conditions (DI-only engine, lots of short trip driving, many more thousands of miles on the odometer), but not even 10k miles on a naturally aspirated port fuel injection engine? That does not make a lot of sense unless you already had a rough idle, sluggish overall throttle response, misfires, etc. In a perfect world, the cost to borescope the intake would be minimal, and you could then decide for yourself if the condition warranted treatment. But I'll bet the cost of a borescope at a dealer would be in line with the cost of the induction service itself.

You will never find Ford Motor Company "recommending" that kind of chemical induction service work at x miles interval in any written form. Their dealers are not under that kind of constraint; it's probably more of a concern for them that the service doesn't cause any additional problem.

Last year Ford (Motorcraft) and BG 'partnered ( BG Products, Inc., and Motorcraft® Announce the Launch of the Motorcraft® BG Enhanced Chemical Maintenance Program – BG Products, Inc. ). What was metered into your intake probably was in a Motorcraft can, but a BG Chemicals product. You can see the generalize 'procedure' they used here: Ford 2.5L Hybrid Engines – BG Products, Inc.

People used to (and maybe still do) walnut shell blast their intakes. Gotta take the intake manifold off though ($). Is the chemical-only treatment you received as good at cleaning as walnut blasting? BG would probably say yes or likely, for me I'm not sure.

Here's an interesting blurb on walnut blasting - Walnut Shell Blasting – SPEED LOGIC. A CA company, work only on BMW's. Was surprised to see the service could be as low as $300 (including new intake manifold gasket). And the big plus being, you get to actually see before and after. But even they state:

"Walnut Shell Blasting involves "shooting" a mixture of compressed air and Walnut Shells into the Intake Ports to clean carbon deposits and buildup that occurs slowly over time on the Intake Valves. It is considered a scheduled maintenance service that is required only on Engines that have Fuel systems known as Direct Injection (or DI). Many vehicle makes and manufacturers have modern vehicles that are Direct Injection which would also require this cleaning at a specified interval, not just BMWs."

If my dealer recommended that walnut shell sh@T I’d say time for a trade in or I’m gonna look for a different truck!

 

[todd92]

Waiting 10,000 miles for the first oil change could potentially gunk up your port injectors - so consider the fuel injection cleaning a preventative measure.

However, for your next 10,000 mile interval go to “Jiffy Lube” for an oil change only ($100?) at 15,000 miles and add a bottle of Techron or Motorcraft fuel injection cleaner ($35) to your gas tank at about 19,000 miles before your 20,000 dealer oil change only.

Terrible misinformation. Waiting until the recommended service interval will not 'gunk up' fuel injectors.

Ford recommends air induction cleaning at 20k now - your vehicle is a hybrid and the engine only runs 50% of the time, so at the very earliest I would recommend at 30k, if not even 40k. My recommendation would be works package at 10k, works package and cabin filter at 20k, then works and check air filter and induction (if wanted) at 30k...He oversold you work, sorry to say...

Air induction cleaning? You mean replacing the air filter? That interval is 30,000 miles. No such thing as 'air induction cleaning'.

 

[Chops]

Terrible misinformation. Waiting until the recommended service interval will not 'gunk up' fuel injectors.

I said potentially. Waiting 10,000 miles to change the break-in oil on a truck has ruined engines let alone potentially building up gunk & sludge. Don’t be a “10,000 Mile Recommend” sheeple. Talk about misinformation sheesh!

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