Hybrid Transmission Reliability Question

[Rob Cactus Gray]

Ford has been putting this combo into hybrids for quite a few years, with few reported issues. It's very very similar to the Prius but not built by Toyota.

In my mind it's pretty genius! I guess one drawback is space- the same space they fit a turbo engine into can't fit the 2.5L hybrid plus regular starter battery, that battery is under the rear seat in the hybrid.

The battery is under the rear floor board. It is bolted on the truck from the bottom. So while technically accurate you can’t access it from the rear seat.

OP- unless you drive the hybrid under harsh condition frequently: steep hills, towing, hauling, high idling, excessive heat. You will be fine without changing the fluid until 100k miles. The fluid change is easy though. Simple drain spot and fill spot. You will need a pump for fill it back up. I got one at harbor freight for $6ish. The truck needs to be level to fill it. It will spill out of the fill spot when full. Should take more than 45 minutes. My Prius takes about 20 minutes to do.

Sponsored

 

[taralon]

This video shows how power supplied through the planetary provides power to the wheels.

 

[Mlimberg]

Ok, so it the Maverick Hybrid is interesting in that it doesn't have a reverse gear, they simple use the electric motor and disengage the engine completely to reverse, it still uses all the same drivetrain as it would forward and doesn't cause any damage. That's about the most interesting part about it. Other than that, like others have said it's a planetary gear set so you can have both the engine input and the motor input seemlessly to one output, it can adjust infinitily between it's high and low limits, but most likely has preset "gears" as most people tend to prefer that. I've had a Sentra with the cvt from before people ruined them and added that, the CVT lasted 150k miles before it showed any signs of damage with flushes every 30k miles, I think that's pretty reasonable life expectancy for a transmission, but I was tired of the car anyway and able to move on. These Ecvts seem to be a lot more robust, but I would still do service on it twice as often as recommended, and maybe a breaking service at a quarter or fifth of what's recommended if you want it to last a long time. If you do that, after 100k miles, you can start going a bit longer. And I wouldn't do any other service myself till it is completely out of warranty, doesn't necessarily have to be a dealer service, but a professional mechanic is a must till then to make sure everything stays under warranty.

 

[Maverstang]

Ok, so it the Maverick Hybrid is interesting in that it doesn't have a reverse gear, they simple use the electric motor and disengage the engine completely to reverse, it still uses all the same drivetrain as it would forward and doesn't cause any damage. That's about the most interesting part about it. Other than that, like others have said it's a planetary gear set so you can have both the engine input and the motor input seemlessly to one output, it can adjust infinitily between it's high and low limits, but most likely has preset "gears" as most people tend to prefer that. I've had a Sentra with the cvt from before people ruined them and added that, the CVT lasted 150k miles before it showed any signs of damage with flushes every 30k miles, I think that's pretty reasonable life expectancy for a transmission, but I was tired of the car anyway and able to move on, and sold it to a dealer for quite a lot more than I thought it was worth with that.

There are no speed presets in the power split single planet design. The engine rpm is simply a reflection of the kw power needed for any particular driving situation. That is why it has the power % gauge instead of a tachometer.

There is no belt and drum setup like the Sentra CVT you referenced. Although the Nissan CVT does last with the right maintenance, this system has less moving parts and, more importantly, no wear parts. Hence it will last longer with virtually no maintenance, like all those NYC Escape hybrids and Prius taxis.

 

[vabchusa]

I have a 2015 Ford Cmax and the trans service is 150k, I did it at 120k. These trans shouldn't need much maintenance as there are no clutches to burn the oil. I now have 168k on it an am needing a new trans, basically due to known design problems. Fords price is about $8500 and most trans shops will not touch a hybrid trans. My car has a resale of between $5-6k so not feasible to repair.

 

[Maverstang]

I have a 2015 Ford Cmax and the trans service is 150k, I did it at 120k. These trans shouldn't need much maintenance as there are no clutches to burn the oil. I now have 168k on it an am needing a new trans, basically due to known design problems. Fords price is about $8500 and most trans shops will not touch a hybrid trans. My car has a resale of between $5-6k so not feasible to repair.

I think you must be referring to some 2013-2015 models where Ford under sized one of the motor shaft bearings as a cost reduction, which caused some premature bearing failures. The fix is to replace that bearing, which unfortunately requires disassembly, hence the high cost. Apparently it was resolved from 2016 onward.

If you’re feeling adventurous, you might want to take it apart yourself and replace it. Heck of a learning experience, and what do you have to loose?!

 

[My1stFord]

This video shows how power supplied through the planetary provides power to the wheels.

Thanks man. This is a complicated setup and I want to understand it. I appreciate the assistance.

 

[ffoc01]

I have a 2015 Ford Cmax and the trans service is 150k, I did it at 120k. These trans shouldn't need much maintenance as there are no clutches to burn the oil. I now have 168k on it an am needing a new trans, basically due to known design problems. Fords price is about $8500 and most trans shops will not touch a hybrid trans. My car has a resale of between $5-6k so not feasible to repair.

You might want to check with the dealer on this one. Especially if it's the one who's ordered your Maverick.

Ford's bulletin 20-2219 specifies a transfer shaft bearing repair/update kit to address that problem. Depending on which bearing failed (transfer shaft or differential carrier) and severity, it should be able to be repaired.

Or at least look for someone who'd put a used transmission in for you instead.

 

[clavicus]

Thanks man. This is a complicated setup and I want to understand it. I appreciate the assistance.

I feel like this video is a counterpart to that first one linked in this post. It really goes through all the modes and discusses more about how the ICE and planetary gearset interract.

 

[Farmboy]

Excellent review of Hybrid transmission and explained in a manner everyone can understand. Thanks

 

[sanpablo]

Guess it comes down to personal preference. I prefer changing my fluids much more often than OEM schedules state. And yea, I know everyone will say its a waste of money but I am savvy at figuring things out and doing DIY maintenance myself. I just think manufacturers build most vehicles as a throw away vehicle when its at the point of needing (or failing parts) due to lack of maintenance that could have been done or want the service repairs vs buying a new vehicle after the repair costs exceed the costs to fix. Guess I'm stubborn but I don't mind learning and doing my own maintenance and fluid changes more often

I agree with you. I do synthetic oil changes at 5000 miles (oil life is sometimes at 30-40% life left!) CVT trans drain and fill at 30,000. Coolant at 6 years or 50,000 miles. Brake fluid flush every 3 years.
I think on the Mav hybrid I will do ECVT drain and fill at 50,000 miles. All these maintenance items are pretty easy to do DIY. I use OEM fluids and filters.

 

[slooose42]

OP you've only had 2 automatic transmissions fail on you? My 2002 Acura TL had 3 fail during my 2-year ownership..

1971 Plymouth Satelite with a 318 went 30 years with out any fluid change.

 

[Camlt12010]

OP you've only had 2 automatic transmissions fail on you? My 2002 Acura TL had 3 fail during my 2-year ownership..

I've only had 1 automatic transmission fail on me and that was about 45 years ago under heavy abuse. I'm a big believer in changing trans fluid. No way is it lifetime in my book no matter what the claim is about lifetime fluids In my opinion.

 

[vabchusa]

You might want to check with the dealer on this one. Especially if it's the one who's ordered your Maverick.

Ford's bulletin 20-2219 specifies a transfer shaft bearing repair/update kit to address that problem. Depending on which bearing failed (transfer shaft or differential carrier) and severity, it should be able to be repaired.

Or at least look for someone who'd put a used transmission in for you instead.

I am aware of the TSB. Problem is the transfer shaft actually eats into the case and whole trans must be replaced. Have looked into used trans and found on with 45k on it for $1900 and cost to replace is about $1400-1600. Car still is only going to be worth about $6000 so still not feasible. Even in this state (totally drivable but with whine) car is worth about $3000 trade in.

Sponsored