It’s officially a lemon!

[jsus]

I wonder if the dealer would even buy it as a lemon. Why not just take it in as a regular sale and keep the title clean. It's proably a hazy line, but once the customer has the dealer giving the sale price back, I'd think the dealer could handle the transaction as they see fit.

Dealer could certainly buy it if OP inquired. It would be at whatever they determine market value is for trade-ins and they'd sell it at market value as a used vehicle. Maybe they'd offer a bit less because they'll have to hold it for parts to come in before selling it, or maybe they'd just sell it as is, telling the buyer to drive it and bring it back in later....

In "normal" times, that usually means getting much less than you would if the manufacturer bought it back under lemon law or otherwise, because of depreciation. These days, with the market for Mavericks, who knows?

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[jsus]

So you are lemon law-ing a Hybrid Maverick because you refused to drive it with a check engine light on….. even though it drives and is fully under warranty while waiting for parts?
On top of that you are willing to take a loss by accepting an MSRP buy back?

Something seems very off with this story

Is he really pursuing a buyback or did he just want to use the process to force them to speed up the repairs.

 

[wax87]

Sooooo, why did you file the lemon law claim?

because he is from California

 

[avane]

from my guess (and sorry if I missed what the OP said was the culprit), I'd put good money that the CEL was the heat exchanger which is a consistent issue with all Ford hybrids. Replacing the heat exchanger requires a completely new exhaust by the way it's designed. The parts are backordered and I'm waiting on mine for a month now (some people have waited longer) but as long as you're driving in spring/summer conditions, it really is no big deal to drive. Anyways, just saying if everyone thought that the heat exchanger issue was a lemon law issue, we'd have a lot of returned Mavs (let alone Ford hybrids in general)

 

[Phinney Ridge Dave]

My truck has been at the dealer for exactly two months now. I had a check engine light. They thought it was the powertrain control module, but it ended up being the exhaust and muffler system. I filed a lemon law claim and Ford is repurchasing my truck. I’m so sad! I loved my truck.

If I am understanding correctly, this repurchase is not a done deal yet?
Maybe with all of the above to consider, you can re-think the decision?

 

[Captain Blackheart]

In California, a Lemon Law buyback is designated as such on the pink slip, just as they do with salvage vehicles. I worked for a Dodge dealer a few years back and my assigned van was just bizarre in what problems would surface. I eventually found the manufacturer's decal that declared the vehicle as a Lemon Law buyback and not to be sold to the public.

 

[vap0rtranz]

Maybe with all of the above to consider, you can re-think the decision?

The OP's decision to not drive around with a CEL makes sense to me.

My Mav has had the Heat Exchanger codes since February, and after another trip to the dealer yesterday, I was told to call back after May 15th. That'll be 5,000 miles driving around with a CEL lit on a vehicle that's about 1 year old.

Supposedly, my CEL codes about the heat exchanger valve is OK to drive around failed. This last dealer confirmed that Ford does have a tech bulletin about this. Interesting ... think about that one.

One of the P codes (there are 3-4 that folks have reported on this forum and my Mav has 3 codes) sounds like the exchangers valve is probably stuck. It could be stuck open or closed. Hybrid heat exchangers preheat several things, and evidently route for this heated coolant line is the HV battery. If the valve is stuck open, then the coolant will continue to heat up the HV battery. "Overheated" and "HV batteries" shouldn't be said in the same sentence. Or, the valve could be stuck closed. That's not good in winter. LiOn doesn't do well when its temp is below freezing. Several folks on this forum have had the codes go off over this past winter including me. Depending on how cold everyone's winters are, a closed valve is also a risk. Eitherway, if the exchangers valve is stuck, there's at least 1 component -- the HV LiOn battery -- that could be negatively affected.

I'm not trying to doomsday scare people. It will drive, sure enough, but let's hope someone smart really took at look at this situation, especially for us Hybrids. Ford has a tech bulletin where somebody in Corp decided any risks, like the 1 example above about the valve being stuck, are a non-issue. Those of us with CELs are told to keep driving.

The OP has decided that's too great a risk. Actually, the OP's dealer kinda made that decision for them by keeping the Mav for 2 months.

 

[Automate]

The OP's decision to not drive around with a CEL makes sense to me.

My Mav has had the Heat Exchanger codes since February, and after another trip to the dealer yesterday, I was told to call back after May 15th. That'll be 5,000 miles driving around with a CEL lit on a vehicle that's about 1 year old.

Supposedly, my CEL codes about the heat exchanger valve is OK to drive around failed. This last dealer confirmed that Ford does have a tech bulletin about this. Interesting ... think about that one.

One of the P codes (there are 3-4 that folks have reported on this forum and my Mav has 3 codes) sounds like the exchangers valve is probably stuck. It could be stuck open or closed. Hybrid heat exchangers preheat several things, and evidently route for this heated coolant line is the HV battery. If the valve is stuck open, then the coolant will continue to heat up the HV battery. "Overheated" and "HV batteries" shouldn't be said in the same sentence. Or, the valve could be stuck closed. That's not good in winter. LiOn doesn't do well when its temp is below freezing. Several folks on this forum have had the codes go off over this past winter including me. Depending on how cold everyone's winters are, a closed valve is also a risk. Eitherway, if the exchangers valve is stuck, there's at least 1 component -- the HV LiOn battery -- that could be negatively affected.

I'm not trying to doomsday scare people. It will drive, sure enough, but let's hope someone smart really took at look at this situation, especially for us Hybrids. Ford has a tech bulletin where somebody in Corp decided any risks, like the 1 example above about the valve being stuck, are a non-issue. Those of us with CELs are told to keep driving.

The OP has decided that's too great a risk. Actually, the OP's dealer kinda made that decision for them by keeping the Mav for 2 months.

You make some good point which I will add to.

The heat exchanger value could be moving properly but the movement not being detected. The value would have switches to verify its movement and it could just be a problem with the switches or wiring triggering the CEL.

Even if the valve is not moving, the ECUs are monitoring the battery temperature and limiting the current output of the battery based upon the battery temperature. So you might see some reduction in mpg. Battery temperature can be monitored with FORScan.

If the battery does truly overheat, there would be a shutdown of the drive system

 

[vap0rtranz]

Even if the valve is not moving, the ECUs are monitoring the battery temperature and limiting the current output of the battery based upon the battery temperature. So you might see some reduction in mpg.

Yup, this is what I'm hoping. That sideaffect risks are being checked by other sensors, and the actual affect is lower MPG.

I'd like to be an idealist but have gotten more cynical over time. I mean, Ford's smart engineers are the ones who thought some "durable" plastic would mate well with hot metal exhaust. (Someone else on this forum posted pictures of the suspected components but I don't have the link handy.) So I'm hopeful but can understand folks who don't want to risk it.

 

[avane]

The OP's decision to not drive around with a CEL makes sense to me.

My Mav has had the Heat Exchanger codes since February, and after another trip to the dealer yesterday, I was told to call back after May 15th. That'll be 5,000 miles driving around with a CEL lit on a vehicle that's about 1 year old.

Supposedly, my CEL codes about the heat exchanger valve is OK to drive around failed. This last dealer confirmed that Ford does have a tech bulletin about this. Interesting ... think about that one.

One of the P codes (there are 3-4 that folks have reported on this forum and my Mav has 3 codes) sounds like the exchangers valve is probably stuck. It could be stuck open or closed. Hybrid heat exchangers preheat several things, and evidently route for this heated coolant line is the HV battery. If the valve is stuck open, then the coolant will continue to heat up the HV battery. "Overheated" and "HV batteries" shouldn't be said in the same sentence. Or, the valve could be stuck closed. That's not good in winter. LiOn doesn't do well when its temp is below freezing. Several folks on this forum have had the codes go off over this past winter including me. Depending on how cold everyone's winters are, a closed valve is also a risk. Eitherway, if the exchangers valve is stuck, there's at least 1 component -- the HV LiOn battery -- that could be negatively affected.

I'm not trying to doomsday scare people. It will drive, sure enough, but let's hope someone smart really took at look at this situation, especially for us Hybrids. Ford has a tech bulletin where somebody in Corp decided any risks, like the 1 example above about the valve being stuck, are a non-issue. Those of us with CELs are told to keep driving.

The OP has decided that's too great a risk. Actually, the OP's dealer kinda made that decision for them by keeping the Mav for 2 months.

you know what's interesting is that I got the error code for the heat exchanger a few weeks ago and took it to the dealer to order the parts. But just yesterday, the CEL turned off....Not sure if thats a good or bad thing...lol

 

[BlueSnake77]

Dang, I thought multiple different problems with unsuccessfully attempts to fix were required to use lemon law. This seems way too easy. One problem with only one attempted and failed fix.

I thought so too. I thought it was if they didn't fix the same problem after 3 attempts then they had to buy it back.

 

[vap0rtranz]

you know what's interesting is that I got the error code for the heat exchanger a few weeks ago and took it to the dealer to order the parts. But just yesterday, the CEL turned off....Not sure if thats a good or bad thing...lol

Yea mine did that at 1st. On and off. Then the CEL just stayed lit.

 

[FunctionSpec]

The OP's decision to not drive around with a CEL makes sense to me.

My Mav has had the Heat Exchanger codes since February, and after another trip to the dealer yesterday, I was told to call back after May 15th. That'll be 5,000 miles driving around with a CEL lit on a vehicle that's about 1 year old.

Supposedly, my CEL codes about the heat exchanger valve is OK to drive around failed. This last dealer confirmed that Ford does have a tech bulletin about this. Interesting ... think about that one.

One of the P codes (there are 3-4 that folks have reported on this forum and my Mav has 3 codes) sounds like the exchangers valve is probably stuck. It could be stuck open or closed. Hybrid heat exchangers preheat several things, and evidently route for this heated coolant line is the HV battery. If the valve is stuck open, then the coolant will continue to heat up the HV battery. "Overheated" and "HV batteries" shouldn't be said in the same sentence. Or, the valve could be stuck closed. That's not good in winter. LiOn doesn't do well when its temp is below freezing. Several folks on this forum have had the codes go off over this past winter including me. Depending on how cold everyone's winters are, a closed valve is also a risk. Eitherway, if the exchangers valve is stuck, there's at least 1 component -- the HV LiOn battery -- that could be negatively affected.

I'm not trying to doomsday scare people. It will drive, sure enough, but let's hope someone smart really took at look at this situation, especially for us Hybrids. Ford has a tech bulletin where somebody in Corp decided any risks, like the 1 example above about the valve being stuck, are a non-issue. Those of us with CELs are told to keep driving.

The OP has decided that's too great a risk. Actually, the OP's dealer kinda made that decision for them by keeping the Mav for 2 months.

Thank you for sharing all that information. I hope Ford finds a fix soon. Found a video going over the heat exchanger issue on the Ford hybrids:

 

[vap0rtranz]

Thank you for sharing all that information. I hope Ford finds a fix soon. Found a video going over the heat exchanger issue on the Ford hybrids:

This is a great vid. Thx for sharing it.

I'd also thought another risk to the plastic assembly is a coolant leak, and this owner thinks that can also happen. There are F150 PowerBoost that have a coolant leak for the hybrid heat exchanger. I only mention the F150 PowerBoost because my dealer asked a tech when they found the same symptoms that our Hybrid Mavs have. And this owner's vid confirms the PowerBoost F150s have these risks as well.

 

[vap0rtranz]

P.S.

"Coolant leak".




I know its hyperbolic but just couldn't resist.

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