You can use 87 octane ...but should you?

[BlueSnake77]

I've known about the carbon build up on the DI engines for years now. Never really had an issue with my Focus with the 2.0L, but that didn't have the turbo. What I didn't know was how oil contaminants mixing with the fuel mixture can lower the octane level in the combustion chamber and lead to more buildup on the valves. Was watching a series of videos (there are 4 of them) from this YT channel and the way he explains it makes sense. Especially about what type of detergent is used in certain oils. I'm not thier products. Thier oil is like $18 per qt! Perhaps other companies are offering a similar product for less. But to tell you the truth I would pay an extra $40 or $50 per oil change if the oil I used helped to reduce carbon buildup. Be you own judge as to what he says has any validity .....

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[MLowe05]

Keep in mind he is selling a product.

 

[Pickles]

I feel your question is about detergent oil and not fuel lol am i misreading?

 

[BlueSnake77]

I understand that. As I said be your own judge, but what he says makes some kind of sense and I've seen other videos with similar talking points. I personally would use at least 89 octane fuel in the Ecoboost.

 

[wardamntexas]

I used to work in an engine lab that did regular fuel testing work including a bunch on the original 3.5EB, and did crankcase lubricant certification tests for the chemical companies selling blends to the companies who put jugs of oil on shelves. Full disclosure I didn't watch the video and don't plan to lol.
That said I got some points that come up all the time.

1: buy a quality API certified full synthetic and change it at the interval recommended by the manufacturer of your engine, you'll be fine.

2: Gasoline quality does vary a lot across manufacturers. Look for Top Tier certification. Exxon, Shell, BP, Mobil all have this, so does Costco which is often the cheapest. Grocery store gas sucks.
3: there's nothing inherently cleaner about higher octane fuel. Premium gas usually has more of the detergent agents in it than regular but again, varies by pump. Walmart 93 is gonna be dirtier than Shell 87.

Ultimately as long as you don't fill up at the grocery store every time, you'll be okay. Running the quality gas most or even just some of the time or, if you're real worried the occasional bottle of fuel system cleaner, will keep your engine clean.

Driven oil is *not* API certified because it contains too much zinc which *will* shorten the life of your catalytic converter.

 

[Gpp]

Correct me if im wrong but want the computer pull back the timing if it detects spark knock if the gas doesn’t have enough octane.i may have misunderstood the oil part but i dont think it would have anything to do with spark knock.

 

[Gpp]

I used to work in an engine lab that did regular fuel testing work including a bunch on the original 3.5EB, and did crankcase lubricant certification tests for the chemical companies selling blends to the companies who put jugs of oil on shelves. Full disclosure I didn't watch the video and don't plan to lol.
That said I got some points that come up all the time.

1: buy a quality API certified full synthetic and change it at the interval recommended by the manufacturer of your engine, you'll be fine.

2: Gasoline quality does vary a lot across manufacturers. Look for Top Tier certification. Exxon, Shell, BP, Mobil all have this, so does Costco which is often the cheapest. Grocery store gas sucks.
3: there's nothing inherently cleaner about higher octane fuel. Premium gas usually has more of the detergent agents in it than regular but again, varies by pump. Walmart 93 is gonna be dirtier than Shell 87.

Ultimately as long as you don't fill up at the grocery store every time, you'll be okay. Running the quality gas most or even just some of the time or, if you're real worried the occasional bottle of fuel system cleaner, will keep your engine clean.

Driven oil is *not* API certified because it contains too much zinc which *will* shorten the life of your catalytic converter.

Just out of curiosity what do you consider a grocery store as a gas station.everything in nc sells gas and snacks and a few groceries inside where you pay for gas.

 

[wardamntexas]

Correct me if im wrong but want the computer pull back the timing if it detects spark knock if the gas doesn’t have enough octane.i may have misunderstood the oil part but i dont think it would have anything to do with spark knock.

Carbon buildup on pistons can increase the effective compression ratio, increasing the propensity to knock and requiring the ECM to pull more timing. But any quality fuel will help dissolve those.

 

[wardamntexas]

Just out of curiosity what do you consider a grocery store as a gas station.everything in nc sells gas and snacks and a few groceries inside where you pay for gas.

I'm taking Kroger, HT, Walmart. Not convenience stores, sorry if that was unclear

 

[BlueSnake77]

Correct me if im wrong but want the computer pull back the timing if it detects spark knock if the gas doesn’t have enough octane.i may have misunderstood the oil part but i dont think it would have anything to do with spark knock.

Yes the computer can change the timing, but also, unlike engines of old, modern engines have variable camshafts and timing so the change is mechanical as well as electrical. However, with that being said you will still get better performance using a higher octane fuel in direct injection engines, especially with a turbo. I know premium fuel is crazy expensive now. But if you are going to use 87 octane at least get a GOOD 87 octane as the previous poster stated, a top tier gas. Usually there will be a "top tier" label on the pump, but not always.

https://www.autolist.com/guides/top-tier-gas

https://toptiergas.com/

 

[Decayed]

Carbon buildup on pistons can increase the effective compression ratio, increasing the propensity to knock and requiring the ECM to pull more timing. But any quality fuel will help dissolve those.

It's not buildup on the pistons it's the valves. Gas in direct injection engines doesn't pass by the valves like it used to so they booger up.

 

[MLowe05]

It's not buildup on the pistons it's the valves.

Carbon can build up on both pistons AND valves. Check out any engine teardown of a DI engine.

 

[MLowe05]

I used to work in an engine lab that did regular fuel testing work including a bunch on the original 3.5EB, and did crankcase lubricant certification tests for the chemical companies selling blends to the companies who put jugs of oil on shelves. Full disclosure I didn't watch the video and don't plan to lol.
That said I got some points that come up all the time.

1: buy a quality API certified full synthetic and change it at the interval recommended by the manufacturer of your engine, you'll be fine.

2: Gasoline quality does vary a lot across manufacturers. Look for Top Tier certification. Exxon, Shell, BP, Mobil all have this, so does Costco which is often the cheapest. Grocery store gas sucks.
3: there's nothing inherently cleaner about higher octane fuel. Premium gas usually has more of the detergent agents in it than regular but again, varies by pump. Walmart 93 is gonna be dirtier than Shell 87.

Ultimately as long as you don't fill up at the grocery store every time, you'll be okay. Running the quality gas most or even just some of the time or, if you're real worried the occasional bottle of fuel system cleaner, will keep your engine clean.

Driven oil is *not* API certified because it contains too much zinc which *will* shorten the life of your catalytic converter.

Thank you for the post. Forums are usually completely clogged up with people who have decided they know better than the manufacturers, engineers, etc.

You're going to be told you're wrong regardless of your experience or credentials because someone's aunt's third cousin twice removed used 87 octane in their 1992 Geo Metro and it exploded. But thanks for putting in the work to spread CORRECT information anyway.

 

[GaMaverick]

Use quality 87 octane, quality synthetic oil/filter and catch cans on both clean and dirty side (you’d be shocked how much crap I catch on the clean side PCV).

I only use 93 for towing on these trucks to get the full power and torque values from the manufacturer.

And if your really want to keep those valves clean throw on a water methanol injection kit. Use a 70% water 30% methanol mix (washer fluid without glycol or additives will work). Stick with a small injection nozzle and you won’t have to worry about affecting the stock tune. You will have to change your oil more frequently.

 

[Decayed]

Carbon can build up on both pistons AND valves. Check out any engine teardown of a DI engine.

Much harder to remove from the valves. With the pistons you can use fuel additives. Valves on DI engines never see raw fuel.

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