Which do you think will have less problems/ better longevity the hybrid or eco boost?

[Jasperw229]

The warranty is going to be moot when that battery is sub 70% capacity in 5 years and costs $6000 to replace, ($4,000 part and $2,000 labor, and thats CHEAP)

Not to mention the A/C compressor system on the hybrids cost you $2,000 in parts and another $1,000 in labor, compared to EB $500 part and $500 or less in labor.

Also lets talk range when that battery drops below 80% capacity, the EB will have the upper hand the second you do, as its range is a static known quantifiable number.

I would bet $10,000 the EB models will be around and on the road in 15 years, the hybrids from 2022 won't.

Good thing the hybrid has a 7 year warranty on the powertrain then. I assume that includes the battery, but even if it doesn't a hybrid doesn't need most of its battery capacity to function far more efficiently than the ecoboost motor.
Additionally I doubt that the battery will degrade as badly as you expect it to. Electric car battery technology has become a lot more reliable and long lasting than the early models that gave it a bad name.

Sponsored

 

[Rob Cactus Gray]

I would bet $10,000 the EB models will be around and on the road in 15 years, the hybrids from 2022 won't.

I accept your bet. My hybrid will be on the road in 15 years. Thanks for offering to pay for any maintenance to insure I get there

 

[Jmav2152]

The hybrid doesn't have the tow rating a EB(properly equipped does). So EB are technically going to handle more work, just about double the potential. Now if we had two models consistently carrying the max payload(1.5k) side by side I'm curious to see how they both would hold up over time. But my guess is that most hybrid owners won't be pushing that limit very often if ever. While EB owners probably intend to use that extra power to a extent which is probably why they went that way.

 

[RonFetty]

The last hybrid I owned I purchased new, drove it for 10 years, and if there was any reduction in battery capacity, it never showed it. I actually was getting better mpg than when I bought it regardless of the fact the battery was 10 years old.

a lot of batteries have more capacity than they publish. Battery packs can be designed with degradation offset factors in mind.

for example.

you can design a car to have 300 miles of range and never go below that number with degradation.

how do you do that?
you build the pack bigger than intended and lock the range to 300miles. The end user only sees the 300 mile range(even though they could technically go 330 miles) you use that extra “mileage” for the battery degradation)
so as the battery degrades, you’ve already factored that in.

It’s a more seamless experience, but it will cost upfront mileage(but the end user will think no degradation and could be happier)

 

[brnpttmn]

For craps and giggles I did a cost analysis of if a hybrid vs gas is actually more cost efficient long term from a fuel spending standpoint if you hold your hybrid long enough that you have to replace the high voltage battery.

Keep in mind these assume the following.
The hybrid battery will have to be replaced at 10 year / 300k miles due to natural discharge which btw is not covered under warranty.
The hybrid replacement battery costs somewhere between $2500 - $3000.
This also doesn't factor in trim and vehicle price.
This assumes each tank is filled to 15 gallons and 12k miles travelled per year.
Assumes a constant $3 per gallon of gas @ 87 octane
Assumes the hybrid is getting 37 MPG combined and the 2.0L ecoboost is 26 MPG combined
All values rounded down
This also doesn't assume cold weather driving which drop your fuel efficiency on a hybrid by about 8%.

Fuel over a 10 year period for a hybrid will run ~$9450
Fuel over a 10 year period for a 2.0L ecoboost will run ~ $13,500

So that is $4050 savings running a hybrid assuming no battery replacement. Then somewhere between $1550 - $1050 if you do in year 10.

Now lets assume the battery goes in 8 years
Your fuel is $7560 vs $10800 and a $3240 difference w/o replacing the battery.
Battery replacement that savings is anywhere between $740 and $240.

So end result to get the max savings on fuel you want to get out of your hybrid before the battery goes but even if you don't you should still be net ahead of a gas only 2.0L ecoboost.

There's been much more thorough TCO analysis of ICEV versus HEV, and HEV wins. See this report. This chart on page xxiv shows how HEVs are cheaper overall even when the base price is more expensive. The hybrid maverick starts cheaper.

 

[huunvubu]

The warranty is going to be moot when that battery is sub 70% capacity in 5 years and costs $6000 to replace, ($4,000 part and $2,000 labor, and thats CHEAP)

Not to mention the A/C compressor system on the hybrids cost you $2,000 in parts and another $1,000 in labor, compared to EB $500 part and $500 or less in labor.

Also lets talk range when that battery drops below 80% capacity, the EB will have the upper hand the second you do, as its range is a static known quantifiable number.

I would bet $10,000 the EB models will be around and on the road in 15 years, the hybrids from 2022 won't.

$1000 parts and labor for an AC repair in 2022. You are joking right

Repair on my wife's Taurus in 1999 cost $1006.26 (AC cond, accum) at dealership then another $1169.19 in 2000 for a new AC Compressor at Goodyear whereas Dealership wanted $1600 for same repair.

https://www.iseecars.com/articles/how-much-does-it-cost-to-replace-an-ac-compressor

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The auto AC repair costs that people might face will vary depending on everything from the make and model of their vehicle to the auto repair shop that they choose. But on average, you can expect to pay these prices for auto AC system repairs:

• Anywhere from $170 to $730 for minor AC compressor repairs and anywhere from $1,000 to $4,000 for major AC compressor repairs
• Somewhere between $100 and $140 for a car AC recharge
• About $500 for auto AC hose repair and replacement
• Between $200 and $750 for car AC compressor clutch repair and replacement

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You also seem to have no idea how the HV battery works in a Hybrid while also exaggerating capacity loss and costs. All this seems to be you justifying your EcoBoost purchase to make you feel better.

 

[Maverick2022XL]

There's been much more thorough TCO analysis of ICEV versus HEV, and HEV wins. See this report. This chart on page xxiv shows how HEVs are cheaper overall even when the base price is more expensive. The hybrid maverick starts cheaper.

My premise was simple over the course of 10 years which costs me less in energy costs aka fuel or fuel / electricity for a hybrid. Yeah parts may fail on an ecoboost, they may not. Time will tell on that but what is certain the hybrid battery will eventually discharge and need to be replaced. That is a 100% certainty. That replacement is a valid factor here in the overall energy cost to keep it on the road. Hybrids certainly do win on the short term but I beg to differ long term and I underestimated the replacement battery cost.

 

[brnpttmn]

My premise was simple over the course of 10 years which costs me less in energy costs aka fuel or fuel / electricity for a hybrid. Yeah parts may fail on an ecoboost, they may not. Time will tell on that but what is certain the hybrid battery will eventually discharge and need to be replaced. That is a 100% certainty. That replacement is a valid factor here in the overall energy cost to keep it on the road. Hybrids certainly do win on the short term but I beg to differ long term and I underestimated the replacement battery cost.

Time has told. Hybrid batteries are extremely reliable and have excellent longevity. Literally every component on the vehicle will fail at some point with 100% certainty given enough time. You can't pick out a component that's been shown to be as much a "full life of the vehicle" component as any other part of the drivetrain.

 

[Maverick2022XL]

Time has told. Hybrid batteries are extremely reliable and have excellent longevity. Literally every component on the vehicle will fail at some point with 100% certainty given enough time. You can't pick out a component that's been shown to be as much a "full life of the vehicle" component as any other part of the drivetrain.

Yes I can and did.

If we want to talk about reduction of fuel economy over time then the turbo is fair game. That is also something I left out of the analysis which is equally valid for the hybrid battery. We can also add which will foul the valves quicker since both use port injection but in different ways if you want to keeping going down that path.

 

[hcforde]

As some one who owned a 6.0 powerstroke and the nightmare they are, the 2.0 EB doesn't even scare me in the slightest.

Hybrid most likely wins out down the line but simple fact is that it has limited capabilities before then. It cannot and will not be worked as hard as the EB can and will. And that's not a diss on the hybrid but just the reality of it.

The hybrid is mainly for an in town vehicle, not a vehicle to be "worked". That should be evident by the tow capacity. They are for different markets.

 

[Jmav2152]

The hybrid is mainly for an in town vehicle, not a vehicle to be "worked". That should be evident by the tow capacity. they ae for different markets.

Yea i mentioned that in a later comment. So it would make sense a drivetrain that generally takes less punishment should hold up better that one that doesn't

 

[hcforde]

My premise was simple over the course of 10 years which costs me less in energy costs aka fuel or fuel / electricity for a hybrid. Yeah parts may fail on an ecoboost, they may not. Time will tell on that but what is certain the hybrid battery will eventually discharge and need to be replaced. That is a 100% certainty. That replacement is a valid factor here in the overall energy cost to keep it on the road. Hybrids certainly do win on the short term but I beg to differ long term and I underestimated the replacement battery cost.

Your analysis also held gas as a constant which is erroneous by any reliable standard. Gas will go up as everything else will also. Inflation is a reality in that sector that has to be dealt with.

The human factor that was not considered is, in general, who is buying the ecoboost and how will they use them. They will be driven much harder overall than the hybrid.

I personally am getting a Maverick Hybrid for mostly in town driving. For towing the Ecoboost I ordered will not be enough so I will be getting a Nissan Frontier. A lot of people are going to push the Ecoboost beyond its capability. I am sure Ford is aware of this and has rated it accordingly but it will still be pushed.

 

[TopGunGoose]

The last hybrid I owned I purchased new, drove it for 10 years, and if there was any reduction in battery capacity, it never showed it. I actually was getting better mpg than when I bought it regardless of the fact the battery was 10 years old.

So your car defeated the laws of chemical reactions and physics?

Not likely .

 

[mamboman777]

My premise was simple over the course of 10 years which costs me less in energy costs aka fuel or fuel / electricity for a hybrid. Yeah parts may fail on an ecoboost, they may not. Time will tell on that but what is certain the hybrid battery will eventually discharge and need to be replaced. That is a 100% certainty. That replacement is a valid factor here in the overall energy cost to keep it on the road. Hybrids certainly do win on the short term but I beg to differ long term and I underestimated the replacement battery cost.

I disagree with the way you're calculating. In the same way you're saying that the hybrid battery will need to be replaced you could say it's %100 certain that the Ecoboost will suffer from carbon buildup and need to be cleaned and add that cost to the calculation. It's going to happen, eventually. But predicting failure at 10 years is asinine. The same is true for the battery. Some batteries will probably last a lot longer, some won't.

https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2...rid-taxi-review-400000-miles-of-cabbie-farts/

https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/highest-mileage-new-york-city-taxis-arent-what-you-think-255766

 

[MLowe05]

No forced induction, no direct injection, no belts, no "real" transmission..

This isn't even close. If the Maverick Hybrid is anything like the Prius (which shares a very similar powertrain design) it should easily outlast the EB.

Sponsored