'23 hybrid towing *gulp* 3k

[The Real Maverick]

We have a 2023 Hybrid Highlander too and Toyota parts doesn't even sell a brake controller for it and will not install one. Its not about wiring. Yes, you can wire any brake controller up, that doesn’t mean it will work the way it is supposed to. Regenerative breaking means you will not be using the breaks as much to slow your vehicle down.. unfortunately the trailer doesn’t have regenerative breaking. Its not just the brake light wiring that operates the controller. There is a reason Reese and Tekonsha sites say no model found for a 2024 Ford Maverick Hybrid. I’m sure Reese, Tekonsha and Curt would love to sell their wired products to Mavericks owners. They aren’t stupid.

Go to their sites and check for compatibility. The fact that UHaul refused to install a Tekonsha P3, which they sell and had in stock, on my Maverick because Tekonsha said it wasn’t compatible was more than enough reason to get a Curt Bluetooth which I ordered from Amazon after the Curt site said it was compatible.

So much is wrong with this post.

You know what else Toyota's Parts department doesn't sell?
About 2.9 Million other automotive accessories on the market.

You've stated one fact: you could not find your truck listed on a web site.

Tekonsha P3 works great and AS DESIGNED in the Maverick Hybrid. Also in a Ford E-650 motorhome. Also in a rented U-haul moving truck (the big one). Also in a Hybrid Escape. Also in a Toyota Rav4 Hybrid. I know this for a FACT because I have one P3 with different quick connect pigtails to plug this UNIVERSAL BRAKE CONTROLLER into all of these vehicles.

It is about the wiring. And the wiring is easy. Well. Easy for me. Probably difficult for you. Since you don't have prior experience.

Have a nice day with your less reliable more cheaply made system.

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[GyroRon]

Alright MTC, I've come to the experts. Hoping someone can chime in with real world experience.

I've got a '23 hybrid that I'm considering using to tow ~3k lbs all in (trailer + motos + gear). I would be looking to drive this from Nashville to El Paso to Denver and back to Nashville. Maps says 3k miles. Bikes will be unloaded in El Paso and loaded back in Denver, so I'm only pulling ~1-1.2k in the mountain stretch.

Has anyone had any experience/issues towing above the rated limit with a hybrid? I'm aware of it isn't recommended and that there is an engineering margin built in, but this would save me a lotta dough in gas if doable over my alternative.

I don't see this engine having issues with cruising at 65-70. Found an article that said he got ~28mpg at 2k towing at that speed on flat land. Not really sure if/how the eCVT transmission could be a problem. Braking, I'd just want to play it safe but also can't be that big of an issue at moderate speeds on flat ground. What am I missing?

Thoughts?

So I will throw in my 2 cents as I have a hybrid and I have used it to tow multiple things.

I have used mine to tow a 5x10 open aluminum triton trailer with folding rear ramp, with 3 dirtbikes on it.

I have also used it to tow a large steel double jet ski trailer with two large 3 seat jet skis.

I believe the dirtbike set up is probably just a tad under the 2000 limit and the jet ski set up is closer to 2500 pounds or so.

First thing I will say is the truck has NO problem taking off, pulling it down the road, or stopping.

Second thing I will say is pulling either down the interstate, at 65-70 mph will only get me around 23-24 mpg. This is using the truck in tow haul mode.

From experience with other vehicles and towing enclosed trailers, I will say that towing a enclosed trailer will be harder on the truck than a lightweight open deck trailer. You did not mention what kind of trailer you plan to tow. I don't think if I was planning to tow 3 large motorcycles in a enclosed trailer, that I would want to use the maverick. I wouldn't say the truck won't do it, but I don't think the MPG savings would be worth the added stress on the truck, pulling a enclosed trailer even empty will really work the engine to drag it down the road at 65-70+ mph.

If you were to load 3 ADV bikes onto a 5x10 or even 6x12 open style trailer, I would not hesitate to use the maverick to tow it, even if it is over 2000 pounds. Just use common sense and set cruise to 65, leave plenty of space in front of you for stopping / slowing down, and if you get into the hills and mountains maybe slow down to 60 or so... just listen to the engine and feel how much you are having to push the gas pedal down and if you feel like your working the powertrain hard, just slow up a little.

Some people have commented that there is liability concerns, towing over the listed limit and they do make a good point. If you are found at fault in some kind of nasty accident, where there is potential for lawyers to be involved... If they figure out you were overloaded, there is a chance you could find yourself in a lawsuit. So you should take that into consideration.

 

[BAScott62]

The internet lawyers and adjusters took longer to find this thread than I expected.

Since it has not been brought up yet, your warrantee!!!

 

[OleFordGuy]

All i will say is instead of taking the potential risk using your truck just rent a larger truck that wouldn't have the potential risk for your trip. Peace of mind, safety, well worth it imo

 

[Sykotyk]

My thoughts on trailer breaks. Most systems don’t work on hybrids because hybrids have regeneration breaking that recharges the battery.

The best option is a bluetooth trailer break controller that just plugs into a 7 pin adapter which you will need to add. The trailer then plugs into the bluetooth controller. Most states require trailer breaking for over 2k lbs.

If you run in tow/haul the mechanical brakes get used in addition to regenerative or engine braking

 

[Sykotyk]

Alright MTC, I've come to the experts. Hoping someone can chime in with real world experience.

I've got a '23 hybrid that I'm considering using to tow ~3k lbs all in (trailer + motos + gear). I would be looking to drive this from Nashville to El Paso to Denver and back to Nashville. Maps says 3k miles. Bikes will be unloaded in El Paso and loaded back in Denver, so I'm only pulling ~1-1.2k in the mountain stretch.

Has anyone had any experience/issues towing above the rated limit with a hybrid? I'm aware of it isn't recommended and that there is an engineering margin built in, but this would save me a lotta dough in gas if doable over my alternative.

I don't see this engine having issues with cruising at 65-70. Found an article that said he got ~28mpg at 2k towing at that speed on flat land. Not really sure if/how the eCVT transmission could be a problem. Braking, I'd just want to play it safe but also can't be that big of an issue at moderate speeds on flat ground. What am I missing?

Thoughts?

Route recommendation. Take 54 from El Paso to 287 in Stratford Texas. 287 to Limon to i70. No mountains. Raton pass and the smaller foot hills in Colorado can be avoided. Lots of wide open 65-70mph driving.

Raton pass in the summer will test your engine's cooling capacity

 

[The Real Maverick]

If you run in tow/haul the mechanical brakes get used in addition to regenerative or engine braking

This is always the case.
I tow in Normal mode over normal roads. Tow / Haul changes the effective gear ratio by running the engine at higher RPM both when pulling, and stopping.

And it's a tad the reverse of what you thought. The brake pads, are used a little less.

 

[The Real Maverick]

Some people have commented that there is liability concerns, towing over the listed limit and they do make a good point. If you are found at fault in some kind of nasty accident, where there is potential for lawyers to be involved... If they figure out you were overloaded, there is a chance you could find yourself in a lawsuit.

You've made a point.
But not the point you thought.

Yes, IF you are found AT FAULT in ANY accident, lawyers MAY be involved and insurance won't be happy. Because an investigation said you were at fault.

Maybe you were using a cell phone.
Maybe you fell asleep.
Maybe you drove without headlamps.

You cannot be cited / ticketed for being over-weight. Ask your local law enforcement. I have in many western states. They all say they have no way to cite you based on weight.

If you have a crash, you may be citied for "driving too fast for conditions". "Distracted driving". Something like that.

So everyone PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE leave actual weight out of these discussions. Your assumptions are wrong. Research with your local highway patrol. I DID. I did this in a FEW western states. They laugh and say they have no way to cite a non-commercial driver.

 

[Phimosis]

If I am towing a 3k trailer with a maverick with the 4K tow package and a bicyclist crashes in the bicycle lane, but then tumbles into the car lane and I can’t get stopped in time and I hit the bicyclist, that is an “accident” and I likely would not be found at fault. However, if I am doing the exact same thing in a 2k tow rated maverick without brake controller, and the bicyclist crashes and tumbles into the car lane and I can’t get stopped and hit the bicyclist, I would be found “negligent”, meaning that I failed to use the care that a normally careful person would take in a given situation. Without brake controller, I would absolutely be negligent. With brake controller, I might still be found negligent by a jury of peers because I disregarded the manufacturer’s recommended tow rating.

 

[The Real Maverick]

I don't see how posting "hypotheticals" helps anyone here.

I post practical actually tried and true information. Not hypotheticals.

You can take it or leave it.
At the end of the day, I get paid the same.

 

[GyroRon]

You've made a point.
But not the point you thought.

Yes, IF you are found AT FAULT in ANY accident, lawyers MAY be involved and insurance won't be happy. Because an investigation said you were at fault.

Maybe you were using a cell phone.
Maybe you fell asleep.
Maybe you drove without headlamps.

You cannot be cited / ticketed for being over-weight. Ask your local law enforcement. I have in many western states. They all say they have no way to cite you based on weight.

If you have a crash, you may be citied for "driving too fast for conditions". "Distracted driving". Something like that.

So everyone PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE leave actual weight out of these discussions. Your assumptions are wrong. Research with your local highway patrol. I DID. I did this in a FEW western states. They laugh and say they have no way to cite a non-commercial driver.

I am not saying you would be faulted by the police for being over weight. Matter of fact, I highly doubt... unless you were attempting to pull a 14,000 pound fifth wheel that would be extremely obviously over the trucks rating... They would even know you were 1000 pounds over the trucks limit, simply because 2000 pound towing limit would seem very low for ANY truck. So no, I don't think even if you were 100 percent at fault, that you would be cited for being over weight.

But saying that, If someone were to die or have some sort of life changing injury, I could easily see a civil lawsuit being filed, and I could and would expect any good accident injury lawyer to do a little investigation and figure out you were towing over the limit. Then at that point, you could be sued as being negligent.... Even if you won the court case, you still are on the hook for your legal fees to defend yourself. A hassle no matter how you look at it.

Now saying all that, do I tow over my rated limit? Yeap. Do I mess around with my phone while driving? Yeap. Do I drive over the speed limit? Yeap. I do plenty of things behind the wheel that could be considered unlawful or negligent. So I am not someone pretending to be a angel and telling you you are a bad person for considering towing 1000 pounds over weight. I am just saying it is something that is a reality and you should take that into consideration when trying to make a decision on what vehicle your going to use to tow your bikes out west.

I already told you, if I was you, and I was using my 5x10 open deck trailer, loaded up to close to 3000 pounds of bikes and boots and helmets etc... I would hitch it to my maverick and hit the road without hesitation. But I would try to be extra careful and leave plenty of space between me and the cars ahead of me and I wouldn't push the speed too hard. I also would not probably use my maverick if the trailer is a enclosed trailer, simply because of aero drag from the trailer, even empty would really stress the engine and transmission. You never mentioned what kind of trailer your using and or what bikes and gear your bringing.

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