Ford delays new EV pickup to 2027

[son of a ..sven]

I would also like to add so what if a state don’t have environmental laws?
You do realize we live in a globe right?
How would that be any different than what china or India is doing? You think it magically won’t pollute cause it’s not close to you?
My point is not that we all shouldn’t be concerned but I think it’s much to complicated than pretending that it’s ok to shackle just our country with regulations.

It is complicated...just as the Paris Accords were. Regulations....and shackle...that is a statement. Where to start. So no regulations on exhaust, no regulations on dumping old vehicles...where do you want to stop or start? No regulations on keeping water safe..or our air. It has to start someplace, responsibility has to be owned. Or shall we just forget civilization...

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[Guv]

It is complicated...just as the Paris Accords were. Regulations....and shackle...that is a statement. Where to start. So no regulations on exhaust, no regulations on dumping old vehicles...where do you want to stop or start? No regulations on keeping water safe..or our air. It has to start someplace, responsibility has to be owned. Or shall we just forget civilization...

Who ever said anything about no regulations?

 

[son of a ..sven]

Who ever said anything about no regulations?

Snox801 said:
'I would also like to add so what if a state don’t have environmental laws?
You do realize we live in a globe right?
How would that be any different than what china or India is doing? You think it magically won’t pollute cause it’s not close to you?
My point is not that we all shouldn’t be concerned but I think it’s much to complicated than pretending that it’s ok to shackle just our country with regulations.'

"Shackle just our country with regulations"

 

[son of a ..sven]

Who ever said anything about no regulations?


"Shackle" seems to mean someone wants to de regulate...who? EPA, or? and how much? One of the candidates running promises to toss crucial environmental regulations – including dismantling the federal body with the most power to tackle the climate crisis, including EPA and auto MPG's in the near future.

 

[Guv]

Snox801 said:
'I would also like to add so what if a state don’t have environmental laws?
You do realize we live in a globe right?
How would that be any different than what china or India is doing? You think it magically won’t pollute cause it’s not close to you?
My point is not that we all shouldn’t be concerned but I think it’s much to complicated than pretending that it’s ok to shackle just our country with regulations.'

"Shackle just our country with regulations"

I agree.
Trouble is making others conform.

 

[son of a ..sven]

My thoughts..take care of our own house first.

 

[OleFordGuy]

Not against helping to improve our environment at all, but from my perspective, until environmental issue are addressed/corrected in places like Africa, India, China, etc whatever we do in the US, Canada, England, etc., is like a gnat on an elephants ass towards a real fix. Just my opinion.

 

[Guv]

Spending billions of dollars on some European climate accord when other heavily industrialized countries could give rats ass is just plain stupid.
Take that money and use it here, it’s our money, or our responsibility to pay it back to whoever.
Those countries I’m not naming must think we are the biggest bunch of dumb buggers to give $$$$$$$$ to an organization/consortium that in the end isn’t going to change anything.

 

[Snox801]

Snox801 said:
'I would also like to add so what if a state don’t have environmental laws?
You do realize we live in a globe right?
How would that be any different than what china or India is doing? You think it magically won’t pollute cause it’s not close to you?
My point is not that we all shouldn’t be concerned but I think it’s much to complicated than pretending that it’s ok to shackle just our country with regulations.'

"Shackle just our country with regulations"

I never said we didn’t need or have any. It’s how we go about them first. We have a system that works if it was followed.

The congress can pass laws and the president can sign them. My problem is the epa doing it with a broad clean air act. Which has since been deemed wrong thanks to the courts.
Second we also have a system for all the things you mentioned.
We have a system that if you can show harm you can sue.

So if you decide to dump your old oil into the ground and it contaminated my well by law I can sue. Same with say a fire.
You start a fire outside and it burns over to my property I have the right to seek damages.
Same with environmental stuff.
Or revert back to first statement where the congress can pass the law with voted in reps and the president signs them into law. You know how the country was supposed to work. Not these huge bureaucracies that decide what we do without being elected.

As for taking care of our own house I agree. My point was more towards the fact that some people tend to think and find the need to pretend like they are saving the planet by shackling our country down with crushing regulations for industries while at the same time ignoring the fact they are on buying some of the same products from countries that are massive polluters while making that product.

I’ve never said we shouldn’t try and take care of the planet but it’s how we go about doing so that bothers me.

 

[GmanGM]

To be clear, I am not anti-EV. But I think the industry has some ways to go before the average consumer will accept them, similar to the hybrid.

I saw a review of the new VW Bus EV. One thing that killed it is the range. Just 250 miles on a vehicle that is obviously made for long-distance travel. My 4K-EB Maverick averages roughly 400 miles a tank. In my opinion, the range of an EV needs to be 350-400 miles, minimum. Offering anything less than that on a vehicle that is meant for traveling is simply not acceptable.

And I get it. 250 miles is 3-4 hours of driving and even I will want a break. But until the EV charging infrastructure matures, 250 is just too low. Until I can just mindlessly get on the road without having to plan charging stops, it will be a tough sell.

I also think it is time for the government to come up with a standard for measuring range as driving at highway speeds in the summer heat with an a/c blowing will undoubtedly impact range more than driving in a city in the spring.

I think the PHEV and XR-PHEV approach will be how consumers eventually get into the electric game. It provides the benefit of electric with the convenience of gas.

Hence we need a PHEV Maverick, and they need to bring the Phev Ranger to the US !

 

[Gonzo chris]

I never said we didn’t need or have any. It’s how we go about them first. We have a system that works if it was followed.

The congress can pass laws and the president can sign them. My problem is the epa doing it with a broad clean air act. Which has since been deemed wrong thanks to the courts.
Second we also have a system for all the things you mentioned.
We have a system that if you can show harm you can sue.

So if you decide to dump your old oil into the ground and it contaminated my well by law I can sue. Same with say a fire.
You start a fire outside and it burns over to my property I have the right to seek damages.
Same with environmental stuff.
Or revert back to first statement where the congress can pass the law with voted in reps and the president signs them into law. You know how the country was supposed to work. Not these huge bureaucracies that decide what we do without being elected.

As for taking care of our own house I agree. My point was more towards the fact that some people tend to think and find the need to pretend like they are saving the planet by shackling our country down with crushing regulations for industries while at the same time ignoring the fact they are on buying some of the same products from countries that are massive polluters while making that product.

I’ve never said we shouldn’t try and take care of the planet but it’s how we go about doing so that bothers me.

You're right so the answer is if China pollutes and gives their population cancer at a young age we should do the same in order to compete. And we should not crush our local municipalities with competent schools we should do whatever they do in any third world countries so that we can compete... Been around and around with this on you but I'm not for over regulations but rational ones yes. And with citizen United and corporate spending considered to be speech you will never get a bill through Congress that will go against what a major industry wants. Especially not a veto proof majority. So just say we shouldn't have any federal environmental standards that's the intellectually honest way. Also a lot of companies are now building or relocating things like battery plants to the US to take advantage of current incentives. LG just announced a massive plant being built in Michigan rather than Poland for that very reason. I think you've been consuming too much of certain media if you think everyone who drives an EV is doing so to "pretender saving the planet.".... I don't own one but I recognize the reality is for the life of the vehicle they are more environmentally friendly. No technology or no person is perfect. Allowing the perfect to be the enemy of the good is really an excuse to be against something you don't like personally probably because it doesn't make the right noises, like vroom vroom when you hit the gas and stuff

 

[Gonzo chris]

Not against helping to improve our environment at all, but from my perspective, until environmental issue are addressed/corrected in places like Africa, India, China, etc whatever we do in the US, Canada, England, etc., is like a gnat on an elephants ass towards a real fix. Just my opinion.

Not trying to be mean I'm over 50 but I'm going to assume you're well over 70? England? I didn't know England was an industrial powerhouse these days and what are their environmental laws? I didn't know Canada was a big polluter either. As for China I think you would be a little surprised that the amount of solar they produce not to mention hydro. Not a big fan of them but the idea that the great USA should do nothing unless the shittiest countries on Earth do it as pretty sad. If you look at the pollution per capita the United States still far far exceeds China. And every other country on earth. I would use the those who live in Glass houses argument. So if we pointed China and say you guys are filthy but we are as well... And then they could look at us and say the same and nothing will ever get done.

 

[Snox801]

Chris the problem I have is not any of those state men you propped up.
My problem is you not understanding that a huge push to ev through mandate is not the way. China had exponential grow of emissions over the last few years.
So your answer is to say “we should be better”
Yet as we raise regs and drive all that market share and manufacturing to china the planet gets worse.
Auto industry has a market. That market will be filled. Now the answer is do we hold our moral high ground and let all the work be done in china and pretend that pollution will only affect china or do we look at it rationally and think. Hey maybe we need a different approach.
not to mention neither of us know how clean an ev truly is.

First we need batteries and the mining that goes along. All the oil needed to do that
Then comes power source. Wind, solar? All take massive amount of oil to create.
The. We have tire pollution with is insanely high on ev’s.

I have nothing against ev’s. But this talk like it saving anything is wrong.

Just another expansion of things people ignore to feel like they are making a difference.

https://www.emissionsanalytics.com/news/gaining-traction-losing-tread

 

[Snox801]

Btw.
I personally know farmers in my area that have sold to solar as long term leases. Even though it’s an incredible windfall of money for them. Not a single one has ever walked away without saying how wasteful and environmentally destructive it is.
over a year of diesel power equipment running round the clock, completely destroyed the landscape. So toxic with a leak the land can not be farm after.
And all this is before they are even up and running.
If it was truly the savior of the earth we would not need massive amounts of mandates to force them into the field based on timelines.

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