Flushing my Mav and getting a Toyota

[Blinky]

It is so funny how we get emotional about bad vehicles. OP, I'm not trolling you. I say funny because I had exactly the same reaction to a lemon RAV4 Toyota 20 years ago. That plus a few bad sales experiences at Toyota dealerships in MA just turned me off the brand for life. Haven't set foot in a Toyota dealership since.

Now intellectually, I realize I'm shooting myself in the foot. Statistically Toyota has demonstrably superior product. But emotionally you can't pay me to ever again deal with Toyota dealerships and service departments. A few bad experiences soured me on the brand for life.

I feel like that with Honda. A few bad experiences and one crappy car later and no matter what amazing vehicle they might offer I'm just not falling for the great reputation that they seem to have.
On the other hand, multiple Toyotas have been amazing for me and the dealer network in my city seems to be pretty straight up and reliable.

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[Fryck]

Almost 40 years in dealerships, and I can tell you there is nothing. A technician hates worst an intermittent problem. On a new vehicle like the maverick, they're almost impossible to replicate and diagnose. I've had GMs and Subarus with intermittent problems that were finally diagnosed by the technician taking them home for the weekend.
I hope your Toyota is a better vehicle for you.

 

[Montana]

Wait until they learn how many issues the Rav 4's have...

I'm not blaming you for leaving if you are having problems, but the whole "Toyota because Toyota" argument has been dead for a while. That's kinda the vibe you are giving off here. It's a roll of the dice now days no matter what brand you go to. And this is coming from someone who will consider the new Camry once my Mavericks warranty is up which should put the Camry in year 3 or 4 of production. Apples to oranges in terms of truck to car comparison, same for the RAV 4, but I can't say as a previous Tacoma owner than I would ever buy a Toyota again simple for being a Toyota. If I'm buying something it's going to be for the practicality of it and it fits what I need. The RAV 4 does that you for you, and that's great. But I'm sorry you had a bad experience here.

I think you'll find the mindset is the same for whatever forum/brand you end up with when you are on those forums. You said it yourself, you have owned 4 FORD's up until now and all the sudden it's the worst brand ever. Maybe on your 4th Toyota you will feel the same? I think most people will agree you are doing the right thing and washing your hands, but the overall outlook is silly. Honestly it sounds like more of a bad dealer experience than anything else.

If you trade the RAV4 in and go "I'm done with Toyota, I bought a Subaru" the crowd is going to give you the same response. And it's "Bye Felicia". I understand the need for validation, but you can achieve this with much more tact. No sympathy from me with this post. Enjoy your new RAV-4 and good luck.

 

[Sventinker]

Almost 40 years in dealerships, and I can tell you there is nothing. A technician hates worst an intermittent problem. On a new vehicle like the maverick, they're almost impossible to replicate and diagnose. I've had GMs and Subarus with intermittent problems that were finally diagnosed by the technician taking them home for the weekend.
I hope your Toyota is a better vehicle for you.

I couldn't agree more, The thing that helped me keep my sanity is they could hear the knocking. Ford could have extended my warranty and that might have made me rethink that.

 

[Sventinker]

Wait until they learn how many issues the Rav 4's have...

I'm not blaming you for leaving if you are having problems, but the whole "Toyota because Toyota" argument has been dead for a while. That's kinda the vibe you are giving off here. It's a roll of the dice now days no matter what brand you go to. And this is coming from someone who will consider the new Camry once my Mavericks warranty is up which should put the Camry in year 3 or 4 of production. Apples to oranges in terms of truck to car comparison, same for the RAV 4, but I can't say as a previous Tacoma owner than I would ever buy a Toyota again simple for being a Toyota. If I'm buying something it's going to be for the practicality of it and it fits what I need. The RAV 4 does that you for you, and that's great. But I'm sorry you had a bad experience here.

I think you'll find the mindset is the same for whatever forum/brand you end up with when you are on those forums. You said it yourself, you have owned 4 FORD's up until now and all the sudden it's the worst brand ever. Maybe on your 4th Toyota you will feel the same? I think most people will agree you are doing the right thing and washing your hands, but the overall outlook is silly. Honestly it sounds like more of a bad dealer experience than anything else.

If you trade the RAV4 in and go "I'm done with Toyota, I bought a Subaru" the crowd is going to give you the same response. And it's "Bye Felicia". I understand the need for validation, but you can achieve this with much more tact. No sympathy from me with this post.

I completely agree that my experience with the Mav puts me in the unfortunate minority. There is good and bad in all brands. My choice to leave Ford isn't because I had one bad apple, it is the way they handled it. This forum has been great and helpful. And Honestly all of my interactions with Mav owners in person have been great! Very cool crowd. It was never Toyota because Toyota. I have done a lot of research and this particular (used) vehicle I bought checks the boxes for me. It is also a "J" vin which gives me more confidence over assembly in Canada or Mexico. All the best.

 

[Montana]

I completely agree that my experience with the Mav puts me in the unfortunate minority. There is good and bad in all brands. My choice to leave Ford isn't because I had one bad apple, it is the way they handled it. This forum has been great and helpful. And Honestly all of my interactions with Mav owners in person have been great! Very cool crowd. It was never Toyota because Toyota. I have done a lot of research and this particular (used) vehicle I bought checks the boxes for me. It is also a "J" vin which gives me more confidence over assembly in Canada or Mexico. All the best.

This is a much better way of saying goodbye! I'm sure you will have a positive experience. I had a negative experience with an Escape Hybrid before this so again, I understand to a point. Maybe it just rubbed me the wrong way in the initial post and for my response I apologize to you. I do genuinely wish you the best of luck. Honestly, I'm happy you didn't go for a new Tacoma

 

[PNWMaverick]

Dealer/Service can make or break a buying/ownership experience.

 

[Sventinker]

This is a much better way of saying goodbye! I'm sure you will have a positive experience. I had a negative experience with an Escape Hybrid before this so again, I understand to a point. Maybe it just rubbed me the wrong way in the initial post and for my response I apologize to you. I do genuinely wish you the best of luck. Honestly, I'm happy you didn't go for a new Tacoma

Thanks for the kind words. Take care.

 

[ndmiller]

Completely understand the switch and reason for the switch. Took a chance and so far my Maverick has been fine. If it becomes otherwise, it's a Lexus or Toyota next like every car I've bought for the last 25 years. According to JD Power, Lexus/Toyota STILL top 2 in problems per 100 vehicles. Ford is 24th at 239 compared to average 190.

2024 Most Reliable Car Brands
Problems per 100 Vehicles (PP100)
Car Brands	Score
Lexus	135
Toyota	147
Buick	149
Chevrolet	174
MINI	174

 

[Montana]

Completely understand the switch and reason for the switch. Took a chance and so far my Maverick has been fine. If it becomes otherwise, it's a Lexus or Toyota next like every car I've bought for the last 25 years. According to JD Power, Lexus/Toyota STILL top 2 in problems per 100 vehicles. Ford is 24th at 239 compared to average 190.

2024 Most Reliable Car Brands
Problems per 100 Vehicles (PP100)
Car Brands	Score
Lexus	135
Toyota	147
Buick	149
Chevrolet	174
MINI	174

The marketing and research industry is full of companies who will conduct a survey to determine that 'nine out of ten doctors recommend Brand X'. The research is fake, it's paid for by the company but you can use it in your advertising which is why companies do it.

J.D. Power have a business model where they do surveys and then companies pay them to see the results. In theory it should mean that you can trust the results more and J.D. Power realized that this trust was worth something, so they started doing surveys on products and then going to the winner and saying to them, 'Hey, you came first in our survey, if you pay us money you're allowed to tell your customers that you came first'

 

[Blinky]

Completely understand the switch and reason for the switch. Took a chance and so far my Maverick has been fine. If it becomes otherwise, it's a Lexus or Toyota next like every car I've bought for the last 25 years. According to JD Power, Lexus/Toyota STILL top 2 in problems per 100 vehicles. Ford is 24th at 239 compared to average 190.

2024 Most Reliable Car Brands
Problems per 100 Vehicles (PP100)
Car Brands	Score
Lexus	135
Toyota	147
Buick	149
Chevrolet	174
MINI	174

These numbers are not impressive. At all.

Not that long ago they were MUCH better, I don't recall what years I noticed a real dip in quality since it's been a while since I discussed this with my car buddies but just for fun I just clipped this from a 1994 article, bolding is my emphasis:
"Lexus LS400 owners reported 32 problems per 100 cars in 1994, and four out of five reported no problems at all.
The average number of defects reported per 100 cars in the survey was 110, up from 1993’s 107. Another way to say it: The average 1994 car had 1.1 defects reported by its owner during the first three months of ownership.
Owners of light trucks reported an average of 126 problems per 100 cars--1.26 problems per vehicle, three fewer than in 1993."
- https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1994-05-27-fi-62955-story.html

Toyota has fallen off the ladder, not just in general problems reported but for allowing their competition to be anywhere in the same ballpark as them.

 

[Red Ryder]

Hope the Toyota serves you well. When my Maverick started giving me issues (no-start) that multiple Ford service technicians couldn't resolve, it had to go.

 

[yipga]

RAV4 already go to 5th year for 5th generation and most recalls should already solved but maverick just go through 22 23 24 for first generation and 22 23 should have not much bug fix due to covid so just 2.5 Year. But RAV4 hybrid still have Cablegate problem unsolved when you are driving on cold snow salty road. Those axxhole cut cost on modern cars making them unreliable.

 

[ndmiller]

The marketing and research industry is full of companies who will conduct a survey to determine that 'nine out of ten doctors recommend Brand X'. The research is fake, it's paid for by the company but you can use it in your advertising which is why companies do it.

J.D. Power have a business model where they do surveys and then companies pay them to see the results. In theory it should mean that you can trust the results more and J.D. Power realized that this trust was worth something, so they started doing surveys on products and then going to the winner and saying to them, 'Hey, you came first in our survey, if you pay us money you're allowed to tell your customers that you came first'

Sure your 100% right, my 3 decades of experience with Toyota product is meaningless. Thanks for correcting me.

 

[ndmiller]

These numbers are not impressive. At all.

Not that long ago they were MUCH better, I don't recall what years I noticed a real dip in quality since it's been a while since I discussed this with my car buddies but just for fun I just clipped this from a 1994 article, bolding is my emphasis:
"Lexus LS400 owners reported 32 problems per 100 cars in 1994, and four out of five reported no problems at all.
The average number of defects reported per 100 cars in the survey was 110, up from 1993’s 107. Another way to say it: The average 1994 car had 1.1 defects reported by its owner during the first three months of ownership.
Owners of light trucks reported an average of 126 problems per 100 cars--1.26 problems per vehicle, three fewer than in 1993."
- https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1994-05-27-fi-62955-story.html

Toyota has fallen off the ladder, not just in general problems reported but for allowing their competition to be anywhere in the same ballpark as them.

Yep, another great correction, I sure wish I could buy a new 1994 vehicle these days.

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