Kicker Key 200.4 Install in 2024 Lariat w/ B&O

[austwnh1]

Hey everyone,

Apologies if this has been answered in another thread but I could not find any information.

I replaced the door woofers and dash tweeters with Hertz DSK 170.3 components, removed the center dash speaker, and faded everything forward so the rear speakers aren’t heard (I think the 6x9 B&O woofer is actually still playing despite the fade because it’s wired to the front outputs of the B&O amp). Even with the B&O amp, it sounds pretty good. I didn’t even have to use the crossovers included with the set.

I installed a Kicker Key 200.4 using the high level door speaker output from the B&O amp and am using the key in Bi-Amp mode. I don’t know why, but it sounds horrible. Everything sounds underwater and there’s a pretty significant hiss coming from the tweeters (this I hear is just common with Key Amps).

I’m going to try the tuning tomorrow and see if that works, but I didn’t expect it to sound this bad without the tuning. Also when I turn the tweeter side gain, the hiss increases.

Any tips would be appreciated. If going back to the B&O is ideal, I may just do that. Thanks in advance!

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[colinl]

i have no issues using my factory b&o amp with focal rse165 components up front, and I saw you mention the 6x9 sub. so from that perspective I would remove the key 200.4 and replace it with a key 500.1 and your choice of sub.

 

[Sluggo48313]

Hey everyone,

Apologies if this has been answered in another thread but I could not find any information.

I replaced the door woofers and dash tweeters with Hertz DSK 170.3 components, removed the center dash speaker, and faded everything forward so the rear speakers aren’t heard (I think the 6x9 B&O woofer is actually still playing despite the fade because it’s wired to the front outputs of the B&O amp). Even with the B&O amp, it sounds pretty good. I didn’t even have to use the crossovers included with the set.

I installed a Kicker Key 200.4 using the high level door speaker output from the B&O amp and am using the key in Bi-Amp mode. I don’t know why, but it sounds horrible. Everything sounds underwater and there’s a pretty significant hiss coming from the tweeters (this I hear is just common with Key Amps).

I’m going to try the tuning tomorrow and see if that works, but I didn’t expect it to sound this bad without the tuning. Also when I turn the tweeter side gain, the hiss increases.

Any tips would be appreciated. If going back to the B&O is ideal, I may just do that. Thanks in advance!

Curious. Did you ever get the Key 200.4 to work? Like you, I've upgraded the front stage and while it sounds better, I know the problem is the factory DSP tuning. Without spending thousands, the Key amp would be a great alternative.

 

[colinl]

Curious. Did you ever get the Key 200.4 to work? Like you, I've upgraded the front stage and while it sounds better, I know the problem is the factory DSP tuning. Without spending thousands, the Key amp would be a great alternative.

you most likely don't need a key 200.4 if you have factory B&O. the factory dsp tuning and crossovers are actually highly effective and appropriate for the drivers in each location.

if you don't have at least a powered sub, I'd get that, or better yet the key 500.1 and a real sub of your choice. another worthwhile upgrade would be replacing the center channel and using stereo mode, not surround.

 

[Sluggo48313]

you most likely don't need a key 200.4 if you have factory B&O. the factory dsp tuning and crossovers are actually highly effective and appropriate for the drivers in each location.

if you don't have at least a powered sub, I'd get that, or better yet the key 500.1 and a real sub of your choice. another worthwhile upgrade would be replacing the center channel and using stereo mode, not surround.

I did the Dayton upgrade on the sub. It's a little better, but yeah, next step is kicker key 500.1, Ground Shaker box, and a single JL 10w1v3.

The bass is one thing, and I understand. The front stage still just doesn't sound balanced to me. I've got JL C2 tweeters. I connected the inline crossovers by the amp. I replaced the center channel with a full range from parts express. Same speakers I had in the headrest of a Miata awhile back. Door speakers are Goldwood from parts express. I put some sound deadening in the door but I need to pull it apart and put more in. They are 91db efficient and by themselves they sound decent. Mid bass is improved. It really doesn't sound bad, but...

The whole system is still fatiguing to me. Just doesn't seem right. I'm turning it too loud to hear things that are missing. I know if I had an equalizer I could fix it. I wish real DSP wasn't so expensive....I can't wait for someone to come out with an affordable A2B plug and play amp.

Tweeters pointed at the windshield doesn't help. Maybe if I move them to the door?

 

[colinl]

I did the Dayton upgrade on the sub. It's a little better, but yeah, next step is kicker key 500.1, Ground Shaker box, and a single JL 10w1v3.

The bass is one thing, and I understand. The front stage still just doesn't sound balanced to me. I've got JL C2 tweeters. I connected the inline crossovers by the amp. I replaced the center channel with a full range from parts express. Same speakers I had in the headrest of a Miata awhile back. Door speakers are Goldwood from parts express. I put some sound deadening in the door but I need to pull it apart and put more in. They are 91db efficient and by themselves they sound decent. Mid bass is improved. It really doesn't sound bad, but...

The whole system is still fatiguing to me. Just doesn't seem right. I'm turning it too loud to hear things that are missing. I know if I had an equalizer I could fix it. I wish real DSP wasn't so expensive....I can't wait for someone to come out with an affordable A2B plug and play amp.

Tweeters pointed at the windshield doesn't help. Maybe if I move them to the door?

the key 200.4 likely still isn't your solution. it is a black box, it sets dsp automatically and you don't get to tweak anything other than 3 preset high-pass crossover settings, or whether you want to use bi-amp mode (which you would likely want to do if replacing the B&O amp).

I am assuming you've messed with the factory tone controls a bit. I do have my treble minus 1 or 2 but it's a mild change and I would never tweak it a lot with a 3 band eq.

it's either that the tweeters are harsh for your preferences (I have heard them before, but not recently), or I actually suspect you've got one or more speakers out of phase.

 

[Sluggo48313]

the key 200.4 likely still isn't your solution. it is a black box, it sets dsp automatically and you don't get to tweak anything other than 3 preset high-pass crossover settings, or whether you want to use bi-amp mode (which you would likely want to do if replacing the B&O amp).

I am assuming you've messed with the factory tone controls a bit. I do have my treble minus 1 or 2 but it's a mild change and I would never tweak it a lot with a 3 band eq.

it's either that the tweeters are harsh for your preferences (I have heard them before, but not recently), or I actually suspect you've got one or more speakers out of phase.

I'm on my second set of tweeters. First ones were fabric domes from parts express. They were clearer than the factory ones, but way too hot at 4 ohm and 96db. The JL's are silk dome, 8 ohm, and 91db. Much better. Also, I did the tweeters first, then the door speakers, so it's not the door speakers. I double checked the polarity, its right.

My settings are treble minus 2, mid minus 3, bass plus 3 or 4. And I've played with it endlessly. I discovered source is super important with this system. Sirius radio sucks. HD radio actually sounds better than Sirius. Streaming Sirius from the app on your phone sounds a bit better. Pandora sounds the best. I'm going to try Amazon Unlimited or Tidal which are better yet.

I'm going to do the real-deal sub setup I mentioned above next week and go from there. That should allow me to turn the bass down a bit and make everything seem sharper. At least that's what I'm hoping for.

 

[Sluggo48313]

the key 200.4 likely still isn't your solution. it is a black box, it sets dsp automatically and you don't get to tweak anything other than 3 preset high-pass crossover settings, or whether you want to use bi-amp mode (which you would likely want to do if replacing the B&O amp).

I am assuming you've messed with the factory tone controls a bit. I do have my treble minus 1 or 2 but it's a mild change and I would never tweak it a lot with a 3 band eq.

it's either that the tweeters are harsh for your preferences (I have heard them before, but not recently), or I actually suspect you've got one or more speakers out of phase.

I just tested the speakers using an iPhone app called "speaker pop". The right door speaker is out of phase. The door speakers are the only ones I used a plug in adapter on. I find it odd that one is correct and one isn't but whatever. The tweets and center I spliced (and they are all correct). Man...I can't believe it. I'm still going to do a proper sub and I should be all set.

 

[colinl]

glad to hear you got it sorted. I saw one other guy a while back who swore the wire pairs were matched to the diagram but also reversed polarity. not sure what's up with that, but your description sounded like it was possibly the issue.

 

[austwnh1]

Curious. Did you ever get the Key 200.4 to work? Like you, I've upgraded the front stage and while it sounds better, I know the problem is the factory DSP tuning. Without spending thousands, the Key amp would be a great alternative.

I ran out of time and gave up. The factory B&O amp actually seems to do pretty well from a power and DSP standpoint, but I do find vocal frequencies a little softer but that could be my speakers.

The Key also had a lot of hissing that I couldn’t ignore. I’ll probably get a small sub to go with my Key 500.1 and just change out the speakers if I feel they’re underpowered with the sub.

 

[colinl]

I ran out of time and gave up. The factory B&O amp actually seems to do pretty well from a power and DSP standpoint, but I do find vocal frequencies a little softer but that could be my speakers.

The Key also had a lot of hissing that I couldn’t ignore. I’ll probably get a small sub to go with my Key 500.1 and just change out the speakers if I feel they’re underpowered with the sub.

are you using surround mode, or stereo?

and are you using the stock center channel speaker?

the reason I ask these 2 questions that the sync unit does send a lot of the vocal range to the center especially in surround mode.

 

[Sluggo48313]

I ran out of time and gave up. The factory B&O amp actually seems to do pretty well from a power and DSP standpoint, but I do find vocal frequencies a little softer but that could be my speakers.

The Key also had a lot of hissing that I couldn’t ignore. I’ll probably get a small sub to go with my Key 500.1 and just change out the speakers if I feel they’re underpowered with the sub.

I just ordered the Sound Design box for the passenger side, a Kicker Key 500.1 and a 2ohm JL 10w1v3. Interesting to note, I upgraded the the front speakers already. On the doors, I used plug and play adapters. Didn't sound right now matter what I did. The passenger door speaker was out of phase. I think it was like that from the factory which is why I tore into my new truck and started to upgrade stuff in the first place(?)

If something sounds "off" or fatiguing with your system, check the polarity. You can download an app for you iPhone called speaker pop. You download and play a test tone from a USB stick, and the app tells you if the speakers are in or out of phase.

 

[jonly2468]

i have no issues using my factory b&o amp with focal rse165 components up front, and I saw you mention the 6x9 sub. so from that perspective I would remove the key 200.4 and replace it with a key 500.1 and your choice of sub.

did you plug the tweeters directly in to the factory b&o tweeter wires or did you use/add a crossover for them?

 

[colinl]

did you plug the tweeters directly in to the factory b&o tweeter wires or did you use/add a crossover for them?

straight into the factory wires. I tested with and without a crossover, and I saw that the factory tweeter didn't have a cap on it, so I installed them without. 2.5 years later and hundreds of hours of playtime later (I have 49k miles on my truck), the tweeters are great and I am positive they would have died if they did not have an appropriate electronic crossover.

 

[jonly2468]

straight into the factory wires. I tested with and without a crossover, and I saw that the factory tweeter didn't have a cap on it, so I installed them without. 2.5 years later and hundreds of hours of playtime later (I have 49k miles on my truck), the tweeters are great and I am positive they would have died if they did not have an appropriate electronic crossover.

ty, just what i needed to know. picking up the RSE-165's this weekend unless you say you wouldn't buy them again haha

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