Is this how Ford typically does business?

[projectvortex]

I recently discovered this forum through a search for other experiences with the Ford Maverick. I need some feedback to determine if mine was a typical buying experience. I ordered a Ford Maverick XLT last September and it arrived Tuesday April 12th. About a week before it arrived, I obtained financing through my employer’s credit union for an amount that exceeded the truck's sticker price. All in needed from the dealership was a buyer’s order for the bank to draft a check. The salesman asked if I would consider financing through Ford. I politely declined, as I already had financing in place, and did not want to go through the application process again. The salesman left the room to speak to his manager, and when he returned, I was informed that if I refused to finance through Ford there would be a markup on the truck's selling price. I responded that I did not feel that a vehicle like this was worth the markup they were asking and walked away.

Two days later I received a call from the salesman, asking what it would take to get me into the truck. I responded; print a buyer’s order for the sticker price of the truck, your finance manager and I will sign it, and you will get a check. That’s all it takes. The salesman agreed and asked me to come in and sign the paperwork. When I arrived and went to the finance manager’s office, there was a tablet on his desk. I was handed a stylus and asked to sign in a giant signature box, with no other text on the screen. It’s not unusual to e-sign documents, but I did ask to see a paper copy of the document. Upon inspection my response was, this isn’t a buyer’s order, and further there’s a clause that states “the price shown above is estimated and that upon verification the customer agrees to a price exceeding the figure shown above.” I need an actual buyer’s order for my credit union.

The finance manager said that this was the document that they used, and he would go speak to his manager. The salesman, the finance manager, and what I assume was the sales manager returned a few minutes later and asked again if there was any way I would consider financing through Ford. I replied no, I already made that clear two days ago. They then went into the sales pitch of; this truck is in high demand, they lose money selling it at the sticker price, their phone is ringing off the hook every day from people willing to pay well over sticker price to get this truck. It will take a month for my bank to cut a check. (eyeroll, that’s BS, but so what if it does you sold the truck) The entire time they are going through this I’m thinking to myself how is any of this my problem, and you guys did call me. I of course didn’t say this to them, but I’m really not interested in their problems. Sell me the truck or don’t. Once they picked up that I wasn’t responding to their sales pitch, and really not saying much at all, they suggested that I could finance with them, and then just re-finance with my own credit union. I responded, no that’s dumb, are you going to print an actual buyer’s order and sell me the truck or not? Their response was if you won’t work with us, we can’t make a deal, to which I responded fine, and walked away… again.

First, does Ford always print up sketchy paperwork. The buyer’s order is supposed to lock in the price, not estimate it, and second what’s with this you can only finance through Ford nonsense? Do you like selling cars or not? I’ve never owned a Ford before by the way. This is my first experience with them.

Thanks in advance for the feedback!

Many dealers do this sort of crap. They are scumbags. Period. They should be eliminated. Mine told me at the last minute I had to finance “through them” or I couldn’t get the truck. It was a dealer ordered truck and they called me first. I said OK then the next day re-financed through my credit union anyway, and got 2% of the loan amount for transferring the loan to them!!

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[bomberxl]

Mac Haik of DeSoto by any chance? This is almost a carbon copy of a post last month.

This is such a weird hill to die on. All that matters is out the door price. if your credit union is such a lock and good rate, refinance immediately.

Its business, its not personal.

 

[Poizon_iv_19]

Sorry you got this runaround, Jennifer. I'm 80 and have bought a dozen or so new cars. First, this the dealer, not Ford, and such shenanigans are pretty common. I understand Ford is trying to stop such things, but I don't know how well it will work. You did exactly the right thing. And, no, it doesn't take a month to get the check from your credit union. This stuff is all handled electronically now. As soon as the credit union sees their lein on the title they transfer the funds. It takes a day tops. (And the dealer knows this.)

I made a $500 refundable deposit on September 2, and last Monday the Ford tracker said my vehicle was in production, whatever that means. My salesman has promised no hijinks, but if the dealer jerks me around, I'm prepared to get my deposit back and walk.

Good luck.

What I learned during my horrendous sales axperience is to “Record every convoservation”. Texas is a “one party consent” state so you don’t have to tell them you are recording them if you don’t want to. I got a phone app called TapeACall and it’s great. I called the bank and recorded their offer and will be calling back to the dealer and asking them about the caliber of the offer they tried to force us into. All on record. If I’d have know How apocalyptically badly the in person conversation to buy the truck would go I WOULD WITHOUT A DOUBT RECORDED IT. I would love to have the ability to listen again and see if I actually asked anything that should have set the guy off and have him tell us he didnt want to sell us the truck anymore. Hindsight. Record record record

 

[jsus]

Ford didn't do anything here. They sold the truck to the 3rd party dealer who now owns it and wants to sell it to you.

Texas state law allows for predatory tactics like this, so you have no legal recourse.

https://www.wfaa.com/article/money/...ship/287-a2f19b52-b89e-43eb-b33a-ba7702b132cb

That said, if you qualified for the Ford Credit promotional rates (e.g. 1.9% for 60 months), why wouldn't you take that? At least initially and then immediately refinance with your credit union?

 

[Jennifer1984]

Your right, you made no mistake.
I’m guessing uga is thinking you could’ve just purchased and then turnaround and sold this vehicle yourself for extra $10,000. My guess anyway.
What I do know is if you do finance thru the dealer and then that load is satisfied within 4 months that dealer gets penalized. Now that would be justice.

I wasn't thinking about anything like that. just wanted to buy it and drive it.

 

[Jennifer1984]

Ford didn't do anything here. They sold the truck to the 3rd party dealer who now owns it and wants to sell it to you.

Texas state law allows for predatory tactics like this, so you have no legal recourse.

https://www.wfaa.com/article/money/...ship/287-a2f19b52-b89e-43eb-b33a-ba7702b132cb

That said, if you qualified for the Ford Credit promotional rates (e.g. 1.9% for 60 months), why wouldn't you take that? At least initially and then immediately refinance with your credit union?

Sorry, Ford/Dealer I don't know, I just see a big blue sign with Ford on it.
Why not take their loan? Because I don't want to. Because I don't feel like filling out paperwork, I don't know. I already had money in hand, just take it and give me the car. Why are they making me work?

 

[dalola]

I didn't make a mistake. I didn't do anything. No money changed hands, no one was hurt. What happens to the truck after I walk away doesn't matter to me. I don't see where it helps me to apply for their loan, when I already had one approved and ready to go a week before.

All true, what it really boils down to is how bad you want the truck. If you REALLY want it, you can play their game, let them finance it, then pay it off at the first payment, through your credit union, as others have mentioned. No, you shouldn't have to do this, but, you chose a *hitbag dealer, so....

If you really don't care that much about finding another vehicle, then sure, you can walk. Unfortunately, your *hitbag dealer will keep doing the same thing until someone does exactly as they want, just to get the truck.

Sucks, but it's reality with some of these guys. Good luck which ever way you go. And I would still start a case with Ford Corp at the phone number given, and rip the *hitbag dealer on all their social media. You'll feel better.

 

[jsus]

The salesman left the room to speak to his manager, and when he returned, I was informed that if I refused to finance through Ford there would be a markup on the truck's selling price. I responded that I did not feel that a vehicle like this was worth the markup they were asking and walked away.

My response to this would not be to walk away as it does not appear to be allowed in Texas. I'd have pushed back at that angle.

Source: Texas Independent Automobile Dealers Association
https://www.txiada.org/blog_home.asp?display=214

Can Car Dealers Charge a Higher Price if the Customer Pays in Cash and Doesn't Finance?

To sum up TIADA's understanding of the issue, NO. A vehicle may only have one price. There should be no cash price, credit price, internet price, etc…just one price. Dealers should stop thinking of inventory in terms of “cash cars” and “finance cars” on the lot. You simply have vehicles on your lot, and you accept various methods of payment for those vehicles, which may include cash, 3rd party financing or in-house financing. A customer may negotiate to strike the best bargain; as long as the negotiated price is not contingent upon the payment method, there is no prohibition on price negotiation.
When featuring a sales price of a new or used motor vehicle in an advertisement, the dealer must be willing to sell the motor vehicle for that featured sales price to any retail buyer. The featured sales price shall be the price before the addition or subtraction of any other negotiated items. Destination and dealer preparation charges must be included in the featured sales price.

No person may advertise a savings claim or discount offer on a used motor vehicle….those can only be made on new motor vehicles / franchise dealers. Advertising an "internet price," "e-price," or using similar terms that indicate or create the impression that there is a different or unique sales price for an online or internet consumer or transaction is prohibited. See Texas Administrative Code 43 TAC 255.250 (d-e).

Demanding a higher price if consumer wants to pay cash could be a “hidden finance charge” outlawed by Regulation Z. It may also be a “Deceptive Act or Practice” under state and federal law - A three-part test is used to determine whether a representation, omission, or practice is deceptive. First, the representation, omission, or practice must mislead or be likely to mislead the consumer. Second, the consumer's interpretation of the representation, omission, or practice must be reasonable under the circumstances. Third, the misleading representation, omission, or practice must be material. [FTC policy Statement on Deceptive Acts and Practices]. So, under federal law you could have purchased the vehicle and sued the dealer for the overcharge as an unfair practice and a Regulation Z violation.

The communication of the price by you is an advertisement under federal law. Under federal law, the terms “advertising” or “advertisement” includes any message to the public, however communicated, which promotes a product or service. (Note - there are some exclusions to this definition for Reg. M and Reg Z.) So if your customer saw an advertisement and went to the dealership based upon the advertised price, the dealer may have a “bait and switch” claim. Under this scenario, the customer could sue the dealer for specific performance – asking a judge to order dealer to honor the advertised price.

Some dealers have interpreted the Herbie's enforcement action to mean that prices cannot be negotiated at all. And in fact, many dealers choose not to negotiate price on any deal, period, which is certainly their right; that practice reduces the risk of a regulatory action. However, as stated above, there is currently no federal or state law that explicitly prohibits price negotiation on the sale of a vehicle, as long as substantially similar negotiation takes place in both cash and credit sales.

So, do the policies above make you impervious to a consumer lawsuit or regulatory action? Nope. No such bullet-proof policy exists. These are simply best practices to minimize your risk. Will they be enough to protect your dealership? …maybe.

 

[Timaysz]

I'm hoping I picked a good dealership.. I was referred to the sales manager by my old boss.. This last December he picked up is ordered F350 (which took 11 months from order to purchase) he told be they agreed to 2k under msrp at ordering and that ford raised the price of the truck befor his production started and then at purchase they didn't ad the price increase and still honered the 2k under... When I went in to order the sales manager Rick.. I asked if they could do any better on the msrp since they didn't have to convince / sell me on anything, just place my order... He's a nice guy but said no it's to new a vehicle but will honer a msrp.. That the owners where good people and let him run the place right.. And no markups they want the good reputation and word of mouth... Makes them more money in the long run then trying to jack up the price for a quicker buck

I'm sure the auto industry will be a slower Change.. But look at every thing in the last
20-30 years and how much has changed.. Sales, consumers. Products, services, and even manufacturing. Alot has changed and evolved or disappeared... Take cable TV and they how bad the industry is doing against streaming serves.. Or celll phone market.. The old bag phones and brick phones morfed into the motarola flip phones the the Nokia hand held(remember those? Lol) motarola was leading the pack with technology in the late 90's but didn't want to make the switch to digital and pushed analog to a higher limit but every one was switching to digital and motarola got left in the dust for a few years and opened the door for LG, Samsung, and Apple, cuz they didn't adapt when they should have...
Now in the auto industry u have tesla direct sales and and the way gas prices are and the world supply of oil... Electric will be a big new push I'm sure we haven't seen anything. What to u think the auto market will look like in 10-15 years. Ford want to do more customers orders then fill up dealers lots a... How many people will get fed up with "so I can order this vehicle and have no guarantee on price after 6 months to a year wait" and have no recourse on being deny the sale or pay some jacked up fee cuz of the luck of the draw the dealership you went to people with better business models we're going to pull out ahead what's the parent company supplying the vehicles doesn't do anything about people selling them they're going to lose business in the long run. To a parent vehicle company that is willing to change to the times,
My opinion a Ford GM Chevy whatever wants to go to more custom order sooner or later they're going to have to put the dealers in check or Tesla or what other parent company is willing to do that as going to get a whole lot more business down the road

 

[Dochatley]

What’s bad is Ford allows their dealers to do these things. And we know other brands do the same but this Maverick has turned to many Ford dealers into sleazy crooks. Ok, that may describe most car salesman but Ford needs to step in and do some damage control. They are failing badly.

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