Engine Operating Temperature Cold

[MaveRichard]

After the cold snap of the last two weeks I finally have a better understanding of how this vehicle handles extreme cold.

A few things happen:

1. Normal Idle speed of 1250 is variably increased to 1500. This is most pronounced when below ~15F.
2. 120-140 degrees is "minimum" acceptable coolant temps - this will trigger the ICE to start - the range is dependent on HVAC heat requests and fan speed.
3. The HVB maintains over 60% charge simply due to ICE running to generate heat.

I am not far from you in Michigan and can tell you without hesitation that in these temps the hybrid is always trying to conserve heat. I will occasionally run in tow/sport mode to encourage it up to full operating temperature. This is why they went through the complexity of installing the exhaust heat exchanger.

In regards to the under hood fire recall - it is my understanding that the *fix* involved removing 2-3 of the grill shutters and drilling 3- 3" holes in the underbody shield. This was done as a safety precaution while Ford worked through manufacturing issues with the ICE components that led to windowed blocks(fire). It inherently makes the vehicle less efficient by lessening its ability to retain heat.

Just trying to add value here. Hope this helps!

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[MakinDoForNow]

Blocking the radiator with something the engine will be fine at 32 (0°C) and below. It will not hurt the engine, it will give you more available heat to the cabin, and it will give you more EV miles.

One thing I do is not use cabin heat until the engine needle is at least half way. Also, the needle needs to be just above the C to allow EV driving. But as you’ve seen, EV mode with heat on drains the heat out of the system really fast. I too can watch the needle move down at a 1 minute stoplight.

In the hybrid the ice comes on to get cats to temp for epa. The ice coolant will of course be warmed. The cabin heat uses ice coolant but also has a electric powered ceramic auxiliary heater which when you turn heat on in cold conditions the fan does not come on and blow cold air for a few (10-15 ?) seconds when the ceramic warms up enough to blow warmer than ambient. The ceramic will add BTU's to ice warmed air when needed. If cabin heat is not requested the ice coolant will not be as warm! The ice will possibly run at higher rpm which may cause higher coolant temp but warming HVB, cabin, etc can keep it at 2-3 bars.

 

[Rafa]

Hi Guys

I was driving around for about 40 minutes yesterday (all city driving), and even towards the end of my trip the engine never reached operating temperature, it kept dropping when I turned on the cabin heat.
It was around 32F outside which isn't even that cold yet.

I also did a test near the end of my trip where the engine temperature would climb and be fine, then I'd turn on the cabin heat and it would drop to near cold within a minute.

My understanding is that some of the active shutters were forced into open position because of the engine fire issue. I am thinking of using something to cover that area similar to what I did in my 2012 Lexus CT (~ Prius) in the winter.

What are your thoughts on this situation?

Thanks

You need normal coolant and engine temperature to burn fuel efficiently, otherwise gasoline doesn't burn off completely and is diluting motor oil, the thermostat is not working properly on Maverick hybrid.

 

[wax87]

The shutters are there to direct air around the vehicle instead of through the vehicle. My 2011 cruise has them. They open only when the car needs the the air going through the radiator to cool the engine.

there is an operating range that engines are most efficient. Typically this is between 180 and 240 degrees. Before OBDII you could buy different thermostats that would open at different temperatures. If I remember correctly, 205-215 is the point at which the engine runs cleanest, not most efficiently. In our race cars, we wouldn’t run thermostats, we would run flow restricters because the best performance was a cooler engine, around 170-180 degrees, but we tuned the engines to that temperature.
My Prius doesn’t even have a temperature gauge. I was surprised the hybrid nav’s have one.

Maybe because the Mav is made for towing?

 

[Cherokee]

These new fangled engines,
My whole life I was always told to warm up an engine for a minute at least.
I was told that most engine wear happens before it reaches, ‘Normal operating temperature’ before everything like piston rings for instance reaches full temp and fits better.

Was told cold bearings don’t move as well not as slippery. There for they wear faster.

Was told valves don’t seat/seal as designed until full operational temps have been reached.
Was told lots of stops and restarts were the hardest condition of all for gasoline motors.

But then again when the Odometer shows 100,000 miles the Mavbrid ICE may only have 75,000 miles of use, wild guess of course.

Ford says the ICE starter and my Eco starter are designed for all this start/stop stuff,
I’m not in a big metro. On preflight I still always turn off my Auto Stop/Start.

Us old Fuggars are hard headed dontcha know.

 

[wax87]

back in the day we would never use 5W-30 or 0W-20 oils either,,,

 

[Tiger Dude]

I'm pretty sure the newest engines still use thermostats and that this one has gone bad and is stuck open. As said before, vented grills are for wind resistance not for engine temperature. Cars in Northern Canada still run hot with big ole grills passing full freezing air into the engine bay.

 

[wax87]

Are these grills either 'open or close' or do they modulate base on the need?

 

[The Real Maverick]

Are these grills either 'open or close' or do they modulate base on the need?

Great question and I don't have the answer.

However, when new, in the first few weeks of ownership I looked at mine a few times. I had to have it in park of course. But always "closed".

Cold, medium, or normal "hot" (185°F) mine were always closed.

Can't look at them at 75 mph without a GoPro but I don't have a GoPro but someone reading this must.

Give it a try!

 

[johnDeere]

Are these grills either 'open or close' or do they modulate base on the need?

From what I have seen on "car scanner" with my 23 mav hybrid, they do not fully modulate, but have seen 4 different degrees of openness.
When its below 36 degrees, they are open to 46%.

 

[MaverickDragon]

EB owner here...

Your profile says " Engine: 2.5L Hybrid " ??

 

[710-oil-614]

Your profile says " Engine: 2.5L Hybrid " ??

Yep. And on January 14, 2024 it said 2.0 EcoBoost….

Thanks for checking in!

 

[MaverickDragon]

Before my time...

 

[HeyBales]

From what I have seen on "car scanner" with my 23 mav hybrid, they do not fully modulate, but have seen 4 different degrees of openness.
When its below 36 degrees, they are open to 46%.

That's what I just saw this morning in about 25 F, 48% - didn't notice it changing the whole trip of cold ICE city, to nice warmup on highway, back to city.

Almost wondering if the value was bogus since it didn't change.
There weren't as many PID's for it as I thought, and only the A set of shutters, not the B set I'm guessing on the bottom.
Plenty of error/problem PIDs though.

 

[johnDeere]

That's what I just saw this morning in about 25 F, 48% - didn't notice it changing the whole trip of cold ICE city, to nice warmup on highway, back to city.

Almost wondering if the value was bogus since it didn't change.
There weren't as many PID's for it as I thought, and only the A set of shutters, not the B set I'm guessing on the bottom.
Plenty of error/problem PIDs though.

Forscan showed 4 items for the shutter.
programmed position.
shown position
and two others for showing errors.
In the winter time below 36 I never see it change either.
I don't think this is a bogus reading, as I can get it to open close correctly when i turn on the truck.

When it's above 37 the shutter closes, when it below 36 it opens.
When its warm out above 37, mine stays closed until the coolant get to over 180 degrees.
I was able to install a spring on the shutter to pull it closed for the mounting slop.
There is no reason for the shutter to be open that much.

I know why fords did this, they didn't want the shutter to freeze closed.
They could have programmed the shutter to be closed, when it needed to open, and it was frozen closed, run the fan as a pusher fan and blow hot air at the shutter.
That will thaw out the shutter.
Software monitors, 2 errors settings for the shutter, and programmed position and shown position.
no problem easy peezy.
With the spring It had no problem opening the shutter to max when you turn off the truck.
Just a note,
I was driving on the freeway for 30 miles, 50 degree out, going 75 mph, water temperature 180 and the shutter was open 0%.
The temperature had to clime to 200 before the shutter opened to 20%- 30%.
And that happened 5 times, open to 20-30 % for maybe 2 minutes for 30+ miles.
23 mav hybrid.

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