Ford delays new EV pickup to 2027

[SLINGSHOT]

The Lightning fail was not due its price. It's easy enough to top 80K on an F150. The Lightning has a 100 mile range (maybe) towing a camper. Pretty useless. People don't need or want a full size truck as an energy saving commuter car. The Chevy Bolt was the most sensible EV made to date and GM could sell enough and canned it.

Merry Berry is a genius.

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[LSchicago]

Full size pickup buyers have a reasonable expectation of towing. Building a full size pickup EV is what's stupid.

More than half of F150 buyers never tow, or rarely tow. GM, Ford, and Tesla all sell full size EV trucks. Most of those buyers don't tow.

 

[SLINGSHOT]

EV sales are increasing, not tanking.

As for Hertz, it wasn’t an electric car problem. It was a Tesla problem. Hertz dumped its Teslas because Tesla kept cutting the price of new ones. Hertz is as much a used car company as it is a rental car company. They didn’t sell because no one wants an electric. They sold because of the plunging value of Tesla cars. Plus repair cost were high on Teslas.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/business/hertz-electric-vehicles-tesla.html

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https://archive.ph/8x3Ah

Why would Hertz dump their Tesla rental because the price of new ones changed? m Yes, they could have wanted to get rid of them before their value went down. BUT, the stated reason for getting rid of them was that NO ONE WANTED TO RENT ONE.
When you are on vacation, you don't want to spend a day at a recharge station when the wife and kids want to go see Mickie. Ever been to DisneyWorld? I lived in Kissimmee for 21 years. I can't imagine a few THOUSAND vacationers all lined up waiting to charge their rented EV while the family broils in the sun.
I'll bet that a lot of would be EV purchasers changed their minds after renting one. Very few first time EV owners become second time EV owners. We have become too accustomed to jumping in the family car, loading it up to the ceiling, putting the over flow in the camper and hitting the road for a few hours. An EV requires a totally new mind set.
Opinions don't always translate into real world facts. Maybe a revolution in battery tech, range and re-charge times will eventually come along. Meanwhile an EV is the equivalent of a personal Leer Jet.

 

[Snox801]

6.4 Hemi will live on in the HD trucks.

Well that and they just stated recently that they are gonna do one more run in 25 of the hellcat Durango. So it’s not dead yet.

 

[Snox801]

Half? More like 25-30%. May be much less next year with AWD & 4K offered on the hybrid. My guess is that by the 2028MY redesign, Hybrid will be the only choice.

Do you have official numbers? Even at 30 percent why would they lose that when they already have the drivetrain used in other vehicles. Makes zero sense from a business Standpoint. 30 percent of maverick sales is still a decent number. But I would bet that the hybrid doesn’t make up 70 percent of sales.

 

[Gonzo chris]

Personally, I've only ever driven one. A Volvo that I rented to drive from DC to Delaware for a funeral. It was that experience that showed me that the EV infrastructure has a ways to go. Despite that area being bluer than my truck, the number of actual high speed charger available was poor. That said, I was practically tripping over Tesla superchargers. So, Ford just adopting the Tesla charging port is the correct call.

I've told my wife it is a good thing I bought the Maverick when I did. If I was vehicle shopping right now, I would 100% own a Lightning given the current deals (if not for the Super Duties being roughly the same price).

Yes I think all of the major manufacturers have adopted Tesla's charging standard. Or at least most of them here in North america. In my opinion that's the best thing Tesla has produced, the charging network. I find the car is to be a little bit cheaply made, kind of boring etc. Not manufactured very well....

 

[Snox801]

More than half of F150 buyers never tow, or rarely tow. GM, Ford, and Tesla all sell full size EV trucks. Most of those buyers don't tow.

Yes but almost all buy them with the idea they could or would. I literally am shocked at the number of people who still have to order “towing” rear ends in case they decide to tow me day.

 

[MetalThunder]

Just a bit of History
In the Early 90 's Chrysler was going to put an electric minivan to market - Was very close to hitting production and packaging for the vehicle was being developed so parts could be delivered to the assembly line ( was involved) - Then the Iraq Gulf War happened - Emphasis was put on the Defense Department needs for batteries / engineering etc... for the battlefield That project never saw the light of day even though it was ready to go - and here we are

Remembering the Chrysler TEVan, the All-Electric Minivan You Didn't Know Existed - autoevolution

 

[Gonzo chris]

Unfortunately those price declines aren't translating to significant savings for Ford. The battery in a Tesla, which is among the cheapest in the world, is still in the mid teens by comparison. I've read Ford is charging $35,000 for a new battery for the Lightning. IIRC it's 133 kWh.

Yeah who knows. What it cost them and what they charge for a replacement battery are two different things. I don't think you could just get a replacement battery off the shelf so they kind of have you by the shorties. I guess the point is they are getting cheaper and cheaper and I don't see the same thing happening to any significant amount with gasoline in the future. So with many fewer parts to make price parity is pretty close and already here with some models. However there is still a cost penalty for an EV for the most part. That cost is made up through gas savings eventually. In my household it would make more sense for my wife to have one she drives probably three times as many miles as me in a typical work day. My commute is only 7 miles round trip ...

 

[Snox801]

Driver satisfaction with turbo lag and an automatic? Nope. Give me naturally aspirated and a manual. Autos are for dudes who pee seated.. but seriously a battery providing extra torque is better in many cases then a turbo so not sure why a higher power ICE with a battery and more powerful electric motor would provide less fun than a slushbox with turbo lag.

I’ve driven both on a regular basis. If you can’t notice the difference in power auto or not I’m not sure how to help.
Not saying a proper hybrid couldn’t be fun especially like you said with the added power from a stop. But ford has not gone that route even with the Mach e.

 

[Gonzo chris]

Why would Hertz dump their Tesla rental because the price of new ones changed? m Yes, they could have wanted to get rid of them before their value went down. BUT, the stated reason for getting rid of them was that NO ONE WANTED TO RENT ONE.
When you are on vacation, you don't want to spend a day at a recharge station when the wife and kids want to go see Mickie. Ever been to DisneyWorld? I lived in Kissimmee for 21 years. I can't imagine a few THOUSAND vacationers all lined up waiting to charge their rented EV while the family broils in the sun.
I'll bet that a lot of would be EV purchasers changed their minds after renting one. Very few first time EV owners become second time EV owners. We have become too accustomed to jumping in the family car, loading it up to the ceiling, putting the over flow in the camper and hitting the road for a few hours. An EV requires a totally new mind set.
Opinions don't always translate into real world facts. Maybe a revolution in battery tech, range and re-charge times will eventually come along. Meanwhile an EV is the equivalent of a personal Leer Jet.

Well yes plus the other part is have you ever dealt with the general public? Trying to teach my wife something new turns into an argument. Same with coworkers. People don't want a learning curve when they're on vacation but a lot of it has less to do with the EV end of it and more to do with it with Tesla being more geared towards tech nerds. Also on vacation you don't want to be sitting and charging, it makes no sense. But your Learjet comment makes no sense either. When I'm on vacation that's different than when I'm at home. For people like me who live in the suburbs I would very rarely charge publicly. Probably 98% of the time would be at home. I would put a level two charger in myself plug it in and forget about it till the next morning. I'd probably do that once a week.
As for the towing issue, if I code stuff regularly I would never get an EV truck at this point. But I think the percentages of people who aren't planning on towing anything with your trucks is probably higher than the guys who do it regularly think. I would like to see an accurate poll on what percentage of Mavericks have never towed anything.

 

[Gonzo chris]

I’ve driven both on a regular basis. If you can’t notice the difference in power auto or not I’m not sure how to help.
Not saying a proper hybrid couldn’t be fun especially like you said with the added power from a stop. But ford has not gone that route even with the Mach e.

So you have driven the mach e? It is kind of shocking how much people just quote Ford out here as if they're the harbinger of everything automotive. What I'm saying is an automatic transmission with a torque converter, AKA a slush box, and a turbo with leg is not driving fun. It may have power but it's not exactly a sports car. There is zero reason with the right size battery and motor a Maverick hybrid wouldn't have more power and be faster than the turbo. I currently drive one car that has a naturally aspirated V6 and a manual transmission with rwd and another car with a turbo 4 and then automatic. I know the limitations of a turbo with an auto.

 

[Snox801]

Guessing it may happen but they're watching how the hybrid AWD does for the next couple years. Really, it's kinda a no-brainer at this point. Same tow rating, double the MPGs (city) and about 20% more MPG on the highway.

Ford could really streamline production as well with a single engine/transmission choice.



One thing I love about the hybrid is the simplicity of the ICE, it's just their standard 2.5l non-turbo'd motor they've been making for decades. A turbo on there with the ecoboost DI issues and that further complicates (and reduces MPG) the vehicle
.

Mid like to point out that I have had many very high mileage 2.0 ecoboost since they came out. In fact currently have one at 250k of tuned miles. Zero issues with either. In fact I’m not sure where the turbo failure talk comes from. Do you ever see people sitting around talking about not buying a diesel because the turbo may fail?
plus I’d say take a quick search and see how many more issues seem to pop up on the hybrid than the ecoboost just on this forum alone.
not saying those numbers are correct cause most people don’t come on here to say how Awsome it’s running.
Nope.

 

[Snox801]

So you have driven the mach e? It is kind of shocking how much people just quote for it out here as if they're the harburn zero of everything automotive. What I'm saying is an automatic transmission with a torque converter, AKA a slush box, and a turbo with leg is not driving fun. It may have power but it's not exactly a sports car. There is zero reason with the right size battery and motor a Maverick hybrid wouldn't have more power and be faster than the turbo. I currently drive one car that has a naturally aspirated V6 and a manual transmission with rwd and another car with a turbo 4 and then automatic. I know the limitations of a turbo with an auto.

Yes I have. In fact I’ve driven about any ford had made in the past few years.
I agree an auto is less fun but not zero fun. Mine is tuned for e30 and it’s a shockingly fun truck for what it is.
if ford decides to actually make a fast hybrid then I agree but they have not so that point is moot.

 

[Snox801]

Half? More like 25-30%. May be much less next year with AWD & 4K offered on the hybrid. My guess is that by the 2028MY redesign, Hybrid will be the only choice.

Well from what I could find the hybrid sells just slightly less overall than the ecoboost. So yes let’s say 50 percent.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/c...ord-maverick-hybrid-pickup-sales/72448996007/

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