Budget stock Audio upgrades (XL) - plan, research, options and experimentation

[Abraxis]

I do appreciate the info, and I thought as much, but needed it confirmed. I have settled on either Powerbass OEM replacements, or Morels, or Kickers. Probably use a Kicker 4 channel amp on the front and a 2 channel amp on the rears, along with a CompTR 6 1/2" subwoofer with passive subwoofer bridged on the 2 channel amp. But, I have not pulled the trigger yet. Options are appreciated.

I don't quite understand the setup. The 4 channel will be "on the front" like in bridged mode? The 2 channel is driving both the rear 4" speakers AND the sub? Do you mean that the 4ch is driving both front and rear and a 2ch in bridged mode on the sub? If the latter is the case, I'd recommend you consider a mono amp on the sub. To me no sense buying a 2 channel just to bridge it on a sub when a mono will do the same work but more efficiently.

Also, different strokes for different folks, but I do not intend on amplifying the rear 4" speakers at all. I've never believed in rear fill in a smallish cabin, my home hifi music listening is in stereo (read: 2 channel) and that's how I want my mobile audio as well. I won't go so far as to delete or disable the rears, but I only plan on amplified front components and a small subwoofer.

Good luck with your build!

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[uh50]

I don't quite understand the setup. The 4 channel will be "on the front" like in bridged mode? The 2 channel is driving both the rear 4" speakers AND the sub? Do you mean that the 4ch is driving both front and rear and a 2ch in bridged mode on the sub? If the latter is the case, I'd recommend you consider a mono amp on the sub. To me no sense buying a 2 channel just to bridge it on a sub when a mono will do the same work but more efficiently.

Also, different strokes for different folks, but I do not intend on amplifying the rear 4" speakers at all. I've never believed in rear fill in a smallish cabin, my home hifi music listening is in stereo (read: 2 channel) and that's how I want my mobile audio as well. I won't go so far as to delete or disable the rears, but I only plan on amplified front components and a small subwoofer.

Good luck with your build!

Actually no. The 4 channel in the front is to separate the tweeters and the woofers in the door. The 2 channel I plan on using one channel to drive the drive rear speakers (probably tweeters where the 4" speakers go and some 6 x9 in the bins below). The other channel is to drive the subwoofer (s). But that is only one scenario I'm looking at. Hey there are thousands of ways to skin this cat, errrr Maverick. A lot depends on my final budget, since my wife is controlling the purse.

Edit: Shoot, I may not put subwoofers in at all since I don't want bone jarring bass. If not I may go with a mid-bass specific speaker like a 7" or 8". Still researching. Need to visit a Best Buy and listen to some set ups.

 

[Abraxis]

Actually no. The 4 channel in the front is to separate the tweeters and the woofers in the door. The 2 channel I plan on using one channel to drive the drive rear speakers (probably tweeters where the 4" speakers go and some 6 x9 in the bins below). The other channel is to drive the subwoofer (s). But that is only one scenario I'm looking at. Hey there are thousands of ways to skin this cat, errrr Maverick. A lot depends on my final budget, since my wife is controlling the purse.

Edit: Shoot, I may not put subwoofers in at all since I don't want bone jarring bass. If not I may go with a mid-bass specific speaker like a 7" or 8". Still researching. Need to visit a Best Buy and listen to some set ups.

You may run into limitation on your component choices if you're wanting to find ones where the crossover network will accept what is essentially bi amping. You could always I suppose purchase individual drivers and make your own crossovers or source crossovers separately. Much more work than I'm interested in but I'd be interested to see what your search/build is like

 

[Red Ryder]

You may run into limitation on your component choices if you're wanting to find ones where the crossover network will accept what is essentially bi amping. You could always I suppose purchase individual drivers and make your own crossovers or source crossovers separately. Much more work than I'm interested in but I'd be interested to see what your search/build is like

One can bi-amp components with an amp that offers DSP and eliminate the component's supplied crossover. That's what I plan to do with the Kicker Key 200.4

 

[Abraxis]

One can bi-amp components with an amp that offers DSP and eliminate the component's supplied crossover. That's what I plan to do with the Kicker Key 200.4

That is a rogue (or maybe just modern and I'm an old fart in this regard) move that assumes the onboard dsp is going to outperform a purpose built crossover network. I would never have dsp take the place of capacitors and resistors, but I can see the appeal.

Edit too add: the appeal I think is bigger on cheaper component sets with meager crossovers. The appeal goes away with a higher quality set that comes with a robust crossover

 

[jewc75]

If a bazooka bass tube fits it may fit what you are looking for.

Bazooka BT8014 BT Series 8" 4-ohm Bass Tube® at Crutchfield

 

[Red Ryder]

That is a rogue (or maybe just modern and I'm an old fart in this regard) move that assumes the onboard dsp is going to outperform a purpose built crossover network. I would never have dsp take the place of capacitors and resistors, but I can see the appeal.

Edit too add: the appeal I think is bigger on cheaper component sets with meager crossovers. The appeal goes away with a higher quality set that comes with a robust crossover

I've had my share of speakers with fine traditional crossovers, both in the car and particularly on high-end speakers back in the '80's. That said, active front stage, facilitated with DSP, is ideal for the automotive environment. While good crossovers allow tweeter attenuation for tuning, the Kicker Key 200.4, in active mode, will sample the components, determine crossover points, set time alignment, and levels. In the automotive environment, with all the variables (e.g. dash, pillar, or sail panel tweeter positions), this can optimize the components drivers to their fullest, custom tuned for the unique chamber they're in.

 

[MiSeRyMaNsDeN13]

This kicker tube fits perfect under the rear seat. This is what I have mounted and ready to hook up.

 

[BootXL76]

Alright so round 2 has begun…
Once I’m completely done, I think I’ll be making another post with everything wrapped up into the opening post and link back to this thread…. I like to document this kind of stuff and spark questions and discussions because I can’t tell you how many times a post on a Board from 6 years ago that helped me/saved me…

Anyway, doing the sound deadening on the doors and this is certainly the most time consuming part of everything. If you’re looking to tackle this yourself and wondering how long it’ll take you? The inside of each door panel took me an hour a piece (not whole door, just the removable panel). I added about a half sheet more to this one after the picture (but I ran out of smartmat and moved on to kilmat)

Here’s also the Hertz Cento CK165-F in their housing

 

[Abraxis]

Alright so round 2 has begun…
Once I’m completely done, I think I’ll be making another post with everything wrapped up into the opening post and link back to this thread…. I like to document this kind of stuff and spark questions and discussions because I can’t tell you how many times a post on a Board from 6 years ago that helped me/saved me…

Anyway, doing the sound deadening on the doors and this is probably the most time consuming part of everything. If you’re looking to tackle this yourself and wondering how long it’ll take you? The inside of each door panel took me an hour a piece. I added about a half sheet more to this one after the picture (but I ran out of smartmat and moved on to kilmat)

Here’s also the Hertz Cento CK165-F in their housing

How is the fit on those flat profile cento? The regular depth version is on my short list, but now I am worried that they will not fit. Did you specifically get this version because your experience with the powerbass allowed you to measure and you know the regular depth cento won't clear? TIA

 

[BootXL76]

How is the fit on those flat profile cento? The regular depth version is on my short list, but now I am worried that they will not fit. Did you specifically get this version because your experience with the powerbass allowed you to measure and you know the regular depth cento won't clear? TIA

I went with the flat just because I knew I wouldn’t have to Edit the mounting bracket or find a way to push the speaker into the grille more, in essence I played it safe…. I just now got the first one in, got to still do the inside of the driver door deadening tomorrow…. Went in like a champ with no issues, forgot to take a pic before putting the panel back on tho

Here’s a video of the actual window track operating, in case anybody sees talk about the window track and wonders where the heck it is

If that video doesn’t work, because no videos work for me on this board for some reason…. Picture: (blue arrow is the piece that travels up and down that black window track at the back of the speaker cut out… picture looks like grayish green wires are coming out of it on each side of the track, that’s the window)

 

[uh50]

Alright so round 2 has begun…
Once I’m completely done, I think I’ll be making another post with everything wrapped up into the opening post and link back to this thread…. I like to document this kind of stuff and spark questions and discussions because I can’t tell you how many times a post on a Board from 6 years ago that helped me/saved me…

Anyway, doing the sound deadening on the doors and this is certainly the most time consuming part of everything. If you’re looking to tackle this yourself and wondering how long it’ll take you? The inside of each door panel took me an hour a piece (not whole door, just the removable panel). I added about a half sheet more to this one after the picture (but I ran out of smartmat and moved on to kilmat)


Here’s also the Hertz Cento CK165-F in their housing

Great job on the sound deadening placement. It's another thing I want to do, but again will have to wait. So, you replaced the Powerbass 6 1/2" components for the Hertz Cento CK165-F. Do they sound much better than the Powerbass or is the improvement incremental? Or, is there any improvement at all? I had decided on Powerbass, now do I have to rethink it?

 

[BootXL76]

Great job on the sound deadening placement. It's another thing I want to do, but again will have to wait. So, you replaced the Powerbass 6 1/2" components for the Hertz Cento CK165-F. Do they sound much better than the Powerbass or is the improvement incremental? Or, is there any improvement at all? I had decided on Powerbass, now do I have to rethink it?

Thanks! I went without when I put the powerbass in (well I put a few small pieces in obvious spots) and boy oh boy the doors reverb pretty bad…. Not a “rattle” per say, more resonation…. But very noticeable…. After doing this last night, I see why.
There’s layer of plastic affixing other plastic holding in other plastic and they’re all connected…. If you tap on say the left side of the inside of door panel, the right side rattles

If you’re gonna take the time to do the install, I highly recommend adding the deadening as well, otherwise you may find yourself a few weeks down the line pulling the door panels back off.

As for the sound difference, I don’t know yet …. My back was killing me after finishing one door and going to finish matting the inside inside of the driver door today. Also still have to wire swap on the key and finish running the new tweeter wiring.
Last note, I like the pb and normally would have stuck with them, but once I started down the Hertz road I had it in my head i was going all hertz (to which I really wish they made a 4” component set…. I was playing with designing custom speaker pods to 3D print, as I’d love to be able to rear fill with components (especially cuz the wife doesn’t like when the music is all up front and when she’s with me I could fade to the rear components more). I found a set of Hertz Uno 5 1/4 components for $90, but haven’t been able to figure out a clean spot where they’d still look “stock” (other than the rear doors)

 

[uh50]

Thanks! I went without when I put the powerbass in (well I put a few small pieces in obvious spots) and boy oh boy the doors reverb pretty bad…. Not a “rattle” per say, more resonation…. But very noticeable…. After doing this last night, I see why.
There’s layer of plastic affixing other plastic holding in other plastic and they’re all connected…. If you tap on say the left side of the inside of door panel, the right side rattles

If you’re gonna take the time to do the install, I highly recommend adding the deadening as well, otherwise you may find yourself a few weeks down the line pulling the door panels back off.

As for the sound difference, I don’t know yet …. My back was killing me after finishing one door and going to finish matting the inside inside of the driver door today. Also still have to wire swap on the key and finish running the new tweeter wiring.
Last note, I like the pb and normally would have stuck with them, but once I started down the Hertz road I had it in my head i was going all hertz (to which I really wish they made a 4” component set…. I was playing with designing custom speaker pods to 3D print, as I’d love to be able to rear fill with components (especially cuz the wife doesn’t like when the music is all up front and when she’s with me I could fade to the rear components more). I found a set of Hertz Uno 5 1/4 components for $90, but haven’t been able to figure out a clean spot where they’d still look “stock” (other than the rear doors)

Ok...thanks, the Powerbass Ford OE replacements sounded good. I'm glad, since I had decided on them, along with 4" coax in the rear. Once you get through, let us know what you think of the Hertz. Can't believe the cost of dynamite, etc. anymore.

 

[BootXL76]

Ok...thanks, the Powerbass Ford OE replacements sounded good. I'm glad, since I had decided on them, along with 4" coax in the rear. Once you get through, let us know what you think of the Hertz. Can't believe the cost of dynamite, etc. anymore.

on the dynamat, you can get 15 sq ft of smart mat 90mil for like $24 on Amazon or 18 sq ft of Kilmat 80 mil for like $33.

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