Stealth DSP-Tuned Audio Upgrade with Before/After RTA

[snowkarver]

I'm thinking in that configuration, it would require separate wires to be run up into the dash for the tweeters. Also, I'd have to put a capacitor on the 6.5" to give a 6db high pass around 80Hz and make sure I tapped the subwoofer before that...

Yes, new wires for the tweet. With the side panels on the dash popped, I found them quite easy to fish.

You wouldn't need any kind of passive crossover with this setup - the Key is smart that way. You'd tap the subwoofer before the amp to get a full-range signal. The Key has a selectable 80 Hz active high-pass with a nice 24dB slope to drive the woofer correctly, and then when you set bi-amp mode will automatically detect the tweeter and set the proper 3.2kHz high pass for it (as well as the corresponding 80-3.2K bandpass for the woofer). It's really quite clever.

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[billbillw]

Yes, new wires for the tweet. With the side panels on the dash popped, I found them quite easy to fish.

You wouldn't need any kind of passive crossover with this setup - the Key is smart that way. You'd tap the subwoofer before the amp to get a full-range signal. The Key has a selectable 80 Hz active high-pass with a nice 24dB slope to drive the woofer correctly, and then when you set bi-amp mode will automatically detect the tweeter and set the proper 3.2kHz high pass for it (as well as the corresponding 80-3.2K bandpass for the woofer). It's really quite clever.

I think one of the custom harness builders may have some Key200.4 in stock. Otherwise, I've signed up for notifications from all the vendors that seem legit. Partsexpress is estimating stock on June 2. We'll see if that is true. Damn stifling amount of choices for component speakers these days. I know deep down that anything will be an improvement, but I always go through a lengthy debate on electronics...a flaw for sure.

 

[Delbert]

I feel like this thread has been hijacked. A dsp amp and a sub are the best options for audiophile sound after you upgrade the speakers. Audison is a solid choice, but there are others out there. Nakamichi may be the most cost effective but lacking auto tune. I'd like to see how it turned out.

 

[billbillw]

I feel like this thread has been hijacked. A dsp amp and a sub are the best options for audiophile sound after you upgrade the speakers. Audison is a solid choice, but there are others out there. Nakamichi may be the most cost effective but lacking auto tune. I'd like to see how it turned out.

Spent half the morning looking into the Nakamichi option. It is more expensive than the Puzu C7 and there doesn't seem to be a lot of support or user reviews for the model I could find that is available from US sellers. (NDSK4065AU from Beach Audio).

Overall, I think the extra $110 or so for a Kicker Key would be worth it for support and warranty...if/when they come back in stock.

Nakamichi was a great brand when they were a Japanese brand, but they are not the same company now. I don't know of they have any better quality than the Puzu. I imagine neither would have any meaningful warranty.

 

[Delbert]

The Kicker key works only with the sub. It does work magic integrating the sub into your system. However, full DSP amps allow you to control and integrate each of your speakers into a sound system with the characteristics of your preference. That is the DSP advantage. Modern units integrate amps, line level and impedance adjustment all is one relatively small package.

Nakamichi makes at least a dozen different models, not to mention the legacy models which are still sold by resellers. They have not been marketed much in the usa and their website lacks much technical data. Their DSP technology was intergrated into Lexus upgraded audio systems for years. If you get to hear one of these, you'll want one.

To integrate to a stock system easily, a loopback cable plugs into the head unit where the speakers are connected and then into the DSP. The cable also has a plug to go to the plug which goes to the speakers. Since nobody makes this cable, you will have to purchase the dsp pigtail separately and wire it into the loopback cable you also purchased separately. It is fairly easy since you can do the splices with the cable out of the car and just plug it in when you have the display unit out.

Tuning is done on a PC , tablet or phone connected to the DSP with a cable or bluetooth. A calibrated mic is almost essential. Money would be well spent to have a professional do it. The system will not sound good until the tuning is done. It involves setting crossovers, time delays, phasing and equalizer settings for each speaker, all of it from your console. Audison and Kicker have automated tuning processes so you do not have to go through this.

 

[pandamancer]

Awesome thread with great explanations of your process. Really appreciate the info.

I did have a question or two, though. For the Plug n play harness, you said you got a custom one? Did you just ring them up and describe what you wanted to have them make it? I'm following a somewhat similar path as you, with the Audison AP8.9 mounted behind the rear seat and probably running my own wires for tweeters. Did you use the loopback+factory wiring for the door woofers and rear fills?

 

[colinl]

Tuning is done on a PC , tablet or phone connected to the DSP with a cable or bluetooth. A calibrated mic is almost essential. Money would be well spent to have a professional do it. The system will not sound good until the tuning is done. It involves setting crossovers, time delays, phasing and equalizer settings for each speaker, all of it from your console. Audison and Kicker have automated tuning processes so you do not have to go through this.

A calibrated mic is essential, but it doesn't have to be overly expensive. Here's a decent one for very little cost: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ADR2B84

I have not used Audison but my understanding is that it's fully tweakable. Kicker Key 200.4 and 500.1 amps are amazing - I've used both - but they are completely black box. You can't tune anything other than crossover frequency, which is just a dipswitch (200.4) or knob (500.1). Still completely amazing product at that price point, which is why they're often sold out and backordered.

 

[Red Ryder]

My setup was basically like described above, a Key 200.4 running active, tweeters wired directly to allow the bi-amping. The front speaker outs were tapped before the 200.4 to feed speaker-level inputs into the Kicker HS-10, located behind the seat.

Some old threads that might be helpful:

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/f...cket-to-mount-key-lc2i-behind-glovebox.13078/

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/f...-hideaway-amp-board-to-back-cabin-wall.13013/

https://www.mavericktruckclub.com/f...kicker-remote-bass-level-knob-mounting.14878/

 

[Red Ryder]

Tweeters next.

As others have experienced, these were a pain to install when compared to some of the drop-in options from Focal or Powerbass, as they required some serious dash butchery. But I really wanted Morels for this build.

Tweeters installed. The mounting bracket has a perfect friction fit, so just a couple dabs of cyanoacrylate super glue to lock everything down, and the end result looks so nice I wish I could do some kind of custom removable grille.

Awesome tweeter install! The one thing I never completed was getting my Morel tweeters in. Thanks for sharing, I wish I would have taken that plunge and installed mine.

 

[Mav921]

snowkarver, would you consider mounting the tweeters on the pillar or small black plastic triangle shaped door trim to mitigate the windshield reflection? How much do you think is left on the table having them in the stealthier/factory location?

 

[snowkarver]

snowkarver, would you consider mounting the tweeters on the pillar or small black plastic triangle shaped door trim to mitigate the windshield reflection? How much do you think is left on the table having them in the stealthier/factory location?

There really isn't a ton of room behind that door trim piece - I don't think any decent tweeter would have enough clearance. Same thing with the A pillar - I took off the trim as part of the install and most of the prime real estate is reserved for the airbag. So without some serious fabrication, I don't think either is feasible.

 

[Mav921]

Ok, that makes sense! Thanks!

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