Auto Stop/Start may be going away (per EPA)

[Gid]

I'll be some of you here have taught school and had bus duty at a school where most of the kids get picked up after school by a parent. That pickup scene after school is a s-show. I worked in TX where there are lots of large, stinky vehicles (some of which I've owned), but when a hundred of them are lined up after school to pick up their kids and they don't shut the engines because it's 105 degrees outside, the smell just knocks you out and the added heat of 100 big engines idling makes your sweat roll. Auto shut off on my maverick felt strange for the first 20 times and now it doesn't get my attention. I'm okay with that feature, myself. And I'm happy to never have bus duty again!

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[GmanGM]

Dumb.

100% of vehicles need to be hybrid.
Now.

Demand a hybrid mandate.
Do it.
Do it now.

Make America AutoStop Again. And Again. And Again. And Again.

I have no idea if pure ICE w Start Stop is beneficial (but I think they have a setting to turn it off for those that dont like it, so why ban it), but I do believe Hybrids have proved themselves and every vehicle should at least have a hybrid option. This proven tech is especially agreed to in this forum where the Maverick hybrid version is especially popular. I also have friends / relatives that would not have bought a hybrid 5 yrs ago but now have Accord and Highlander hybrids and love them. For many a Phev version is even better than 'just a hybrid' but if you live somewhere like an apartment where you cant plug in then a Phev is not for you (but I would have much preferred a Maverick Phev). I think Toyota has also proven that even vehicles that previously needed 'ICE power' benefit from Hybrid that is tuned to performance vs economy- they still do better on economy but also better on performance- i.e. Tundra/Tacoma MAX

 

[TheSEARCH]

I have no idea if pure ICE w Start Stop is beneficial (but I think they have a setting to turn it off for those that dont like it, so why ban it), but I do believe Hybrids have proved themselves and every vehicle should at least have a hybrid option. This proven tech is especially agreed to in this forum where the Maverick hybrid version is especially popular. I also have friends / relatives that would not have bought a hybrid 5 yrs ago but now have Accord and Highlander hybrids and love them. For many a Phev version is even better than 'just a hybrid' but if you live somewhere like an apartment where you cant plug in then a Phev is not for you (but I would have much preferred a Maverick Phev). I think Toyota has also proven that even vehicles that previously needed 'ICE power' benefit from Hybrid that is tuned to performance vs economy- they still do better on economy but also better on performance- i.e. Tundra/Tacoma MAX

I would HIGHLY disagree with the Plug Ins being BETTER> The added cost is often 5 grand minimum. You will NEVER make up that cost. Besides me have had many friends go through that choice on the Prius and Rav 4. . It doesn't pay for itself.

Now I had one guy say well he charges at work for free. Sure exceptions are there but few. Plus IF by chance the battery goes bad the cost is way way higher than small battery in regular hybrid verse Plug in Battery cost. ,. I think plug ins are the wrong way to go. Just do the math.

 

[The Real Maverick]

I would HIGHLY disagree with the Plug Ins being BETTER> The added cost is often 5 grand minimum. You will NEVER make up that cost. Besides me have had many friends go through that choice on the Prius and Rav 4. . It doesn't pay for itself.

Now I had one guy say well he charges at work for free. Sure exceptions are there but few. Plus IF by chance the battery goes bad the cost is way way higher than small battery in regular hybrid verse Plug in Battery cost. ,. I think plug ins are the wrong way to go. Just do the math.

It's not always about math.

But PHEV is for a subset of the population. Just like a gas only car is.

 

[TheSEARCH]

It's not always about math.

But PHEV is for a subset of the population. Just like a gas only car is.

If it never pays for itself. WHY? Just to waste money? I would really like you to explain.

Again some exception like they drive 30 miles to work then charge at work for free drive home all EV. Sure it MIGHT just pay for itself. But for most its a loss. Plus added risk of battery replacement cost.

 

[The Real Maverick]

If it never pays for itself. WHY? Just to waste money? I would really like you to explain.

During the peak of Covid I never had to go to a gas station. Never got my hands dirty. Never had to inhale gasoline fumes.

For 30-40 miles per day, did not create air pollution.

Most home solar cannot charge full EV's in a day. But they can recharge 30-40 miles.

I could go on and on.
But one is not for you, I guess.

 

[HenryFord]

I was just listening to Autoline talking about this issue. It does not sound like it is going away, but the manufacturers aren't going to get the tax break or incentive for having it. It will be completely up to the manufacturer if they want to include the feature.

Now if the manufacturers would take the clue that we want to be able to turn on or turn off the gazillion diff features and have that setting stay in place until it is changed again I would be quite happy. Instead we auto default to turning on stuff which is not cool. Let me set what I want and remember it. If the OEMs what to include auto stop fine, but give buyers the right to be in control.

 

[TheSEARCH]

During the peak of Covid I never had to go to a gas station. Never got my hands dirty. Never had to inhale gasoline fumes.

For 30-40 miles per day, did not create air pollution.

Most home solar cannot charge full EV's in a day. But they can recharge 30-40 miles.

I could go on and on.
But one is not for you, I guess.

Its ONLY for people who have money to spare. I guess I cant wrap my head around wasting money. Some people can afford it others cant. BUT it sure isn't better in any real way. I hope they never make a Mav in plug in UNLESS they still offer the regular hybrid too.

But like you said to each there own,

 

[Snox801]

I have no idea if pure ICE w Start Stop is beneficial (but I think they have a setting to turn it off for those that dont like it, so why ban it), but I do believe Hybrids have proved themselves and every vehicle should at least have a hybrid option. This proven tech is especially agreed to in this forum where the Maverick hybrid version is especially popular. I also have friends / relatives that would not have bought a hybrid 5 yrs ago but now have Accord and Highlander hybrids and love them. For many a Phev version is even better than 'just a hybrid' but if you live somewhere like an apartment where you cant plug in then a Phev is not for you (but I would have much preferred a Maverick Phev). I think Toyota has also proven that even vehicles that previously needed 'ICE power' benefit from Hybrid that is tuned to performance vs economy- they still do better on economy but also better on performance- i.e. Tundra/Tacoma MAX

Only problem is those same people are the ones complaining eliminating the auto stop start will be bad for the environment. Absolutely zero chance a hybrid is better for that. Just look at strip mining for lithium. Tire dust pollution. And how bad some “green” energy production is for the environment. I have no problem if the vehicle fits your life better. But let’s not pretend it’s doing something it’s not.
Lots of bad environmental things with batteries.

 

[TheSEARCH]

Only problem is those same people are the ones complaining eliminating the auto stop start will be bad for the environment. Absolutely zero chance a hybrid is better for that. Just look at strip mining for lithium. Tire dust pollution. And how bad some “green” energy production is for the environment. I have no problem if the vehicle fits your life better. But let’s not pretend it’s doing something it’s not.
Lots of bad environmental things with batteries.

I know this wasn't directed at my post BUT the very small 1.1 kW battery in Mav is NOT like a 90 kW EV battery. I would NOT put an EV into the same category as a regular hybrid. Maybe a plug in as its about 13 times larger than a regular hybrid. .

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

During the peak of Covid I never had to go to a gas station. Never got my hands dirty. Never had to inhale gasoline fumes.

For 30-40 miles per day, did not create air pollution.

Most home solar cannot charge full EV's in a day. But they can recharge 30-40 miles.

I could go on and on.
But one is not for you, I guess.

I remember going for a long time without buying gas when I had my Chevy Volts. I remember seeing lines at Tesla charging stations and gas stations.

Whenever it was at home, it was plugged in. Combined with rooftop solar..

 

[The Real Maverick]

I remember going for a long time without buying gas when I had my Chevy Volts.

Whenever it was at home, it was plugged in.

I was full EV until late 2022.
But drove 25 miles a day.
11 there, 11 back, 3 during lunch, so the PHEV model would have worked for me.

Now I drive 80 miles a day.
Still possible but no margin.

 

[inline_five]

During the peak of Covid I never had to go to a gas station. Never got my hands dirty. Never had to inhale gasoline fumes.

For 30-40 miles per day, did not create air pollution.

Most home solar cannot charge full EV's in a day. But they can recharge 30-40 miles.

I could go on and on.
But one is not for you, I guess.

You can charge an EV at home just as you could charge a PHEV at home.

At 120v, you get around 4 miles/hour of actual range. So a 12 hour charge session would be about 50 miles of real world range.

From a $ perspective, the running cost of the hybrid is so cheap it would take hundreds of thousands of miles to cover the difference in cost between the mild hybrid and plug-in under most normal circumstances. It would also reduce payload.

Put me down for mild hybrid or full EV, but not a mix of both. They've just never been very successful unless heavily subsidized. Being able to charge 250 miles in five minutes with abundant access to charge ports and an almost unlimited battery life with low degradation I will gladly move into an EV! Honestly can't wait.

 

[scottp01]

Auto start/stop has never been about fuel savings at an individual car level. It's about reducing vehicle emissions.

1 mpg savings x 14.5M vehicles sold in America per year x 13,500 miles per year is ~217 Million of gallons of gas not being burned.

There's zero statistical evidence that auto start/stop is killing your motor. The ECM is programmed to only enable start/stop when the engine is warm and the battery has enough charge to start the motor. Starters are build much beefier to handle the AS/S system, and the ECM stops the engine at TDC to reduce the number of cranks to start the engine. Ford's implementation is one of the best I've seen, taking into account things such as AC usage, ambient temperature and even drive mode.

If having to replace my starter ten years from now and paying a couple bucks more for a battery means my child and grandchildren can breathe air and not smog, I'm fine with doing my part.

 

[HenryFord]

I am coming to the Mav from an EV. Been driving EVs for quite some time. I would not mind an EREV version of the Maverick. Enough battery to mostly be driving in electric mode but onboard power to make sure the battery stays in the sweet state of charge meaty center of the battery and to be able to produce enough power to do some towing or road tripping as needed. I think if they modeled the Maverick after the Escape PHEV that battery isn't large enough to keep me in EV mode most of the time. That would need to be significantly more beefy battery. Something with about a 100 miles of winter time EV range and EREV it for the additional range and work ability and I think that would fit the bill for what I need in a small truck. No one is making anything like that yet so the standard hybrid will just have to do. Probably just as well. The standard hybrid is pretty sorted out at this point and should be a pretty reliable choice for many years ahead.

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