Another reason not to own a EV

[Gonzo chris]

LOL, that's global with some countries EV are mandatory and others like China that were sold but are just sitting. EV technology will have to improve before it's accepted. That being said by that time many other alternatives may well be possible and accepted.

You diss Ford but gave credit to Kia. Do you have any idea how many car manufacturers have gone belly up in the 130 yrs Ford has been in business besides surviving several recessions and a depression? How soon we forget that GM would also been one of those lost manufacturers without the government bailout. For trolling you are hilarious.

FYI Ford is in business to make money. Just for the record it is based on making and selling vehicles. That being self evident you are not grasping the fact that they are governed by what the consumer wants more specifically what the masses want, or will purchase and/or what the market will bear.

Lol? Are you 15? I'm not trolling you just find it hilarious because my IQ is probably 80% higher than yours. Yes, Ford is in the business to make money. You laugh about the global market. The United States is not the largest market anymore. China is. It's unfortunate, but that's the case. I'm not against them making gas cars but you knuckle draggers who hit your prime in '72 think that the world's never going to change. I'm tired of hearing people who never took an economics class talking about the market. It's not a free market. There's all kinds of regulations regarding car has or doesn't have content wise. Safety standards, emissions, etc. If the market was allowed to do what it wanted which was the cheapest product that meets people's needs and wants there would be no emissions controls at all. We would still have smog, as a matter of fact it would be 10 times worse with the number of cars on the road worldwide, etc. Again I said I hope Ford can stay on as a domestic manufacturer of big trucks to guys who fancy themselves libertarians or militiamen or whatever. I don't know what you think you are in your fantasy world......
Also, would you like me to do a chart just regarding United States market and EV growth over the last 10 years? It tracks very similar to that one.

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[Gonzo chris]

LOL, that's global with some countries EV are mandatory and others like China that were sold but are just sitting. EV technology will have to improve before it's accepted. That being said by that time many other alternatives may well be possible and accepted.

You diss Ford but gave credit to Kia. Do you have any idea how many car manufacturers have gone belly up in the 130 yrs Ford has been in business besides surviving several recessions and a depression? How soon we forget that GM would also been one of those lost manufacturers without the government bailout. For trolling you are hilarious.

FYI Ford is in business to make money. Just for the record it is based on making and selling vehicles. That being self evident you are not grasping the fact that they are governed by what the consumer wants more specifically what the masses want, or will purchase and/or what the market will bear.

You also forget that Ford said they would have gone belly up as you say, giddy up giddy up...lol.... If GM did. That had more to do with the credit crunch than product by the way.
I have no idea what 130 years has to do with anything. The people who were designing and building and buying those vehicles are all dead and gone. So is that market. I hope ford not only survives but thrives but if they listen to what you guys want him to do and don't cover all bases they will not. I am not saying they should only make EVs but the idea is they should retrench and just make the same thing they've been making for 100 years is ridiculous. Do you only invest in one stock? Also my point is Kia and Hyundai were laughing stocks in this country just 20 years ago and look at where they're at now. I'm "dissing" Ford as constructive criticism. Blind loyalty to a brand is how the Japanese are our lunch in the 70's and the big three are not as dominat as they should be

 

[Hunters Edge]

Lol? Are you 15? I'm not trolling you just find it hilarious because my IQ is probably 80% higher than yours. Yes, Ford is in the business to make money. You laugh about the global market. The United States is not the largest market anymore. China is. It's unfortunate, but that's the case. I'm not against them making gas cars but you knuckle draggers who hit your prime in '72 think that the world's never going to change. I'm tired of hearing people who never took an economics class talking about the market. It's not a free market. There's all kinds of regulations regarding car has or doesn't have content wise. Safety standards, emissions, etc. If the market was allowed to do what it wanted which was the cheapest product that meets people's needs and wants there would be no emissions controls at all. We would still have smog, as a matter of fact it would be 10 times worse with the number of cars on the road worldwide, etc. Again I said I hope Ford can stay on as a domestic manufacturer of big trucks to guys who fancy themselves libertarians or militiamen or whatever. I don't know what you think you are in your fantasy world......
Also, would you like me to do a chart just regarding United States market and EV growth over the last 10 years? It tracks very similar to that one.

You also forget that Ford said they would have gone belly up as you say, giddy up giddy up...lol.... If GM did. That had more to do with the credit crunch than product by the way.
I have no idea what 130 years has to do with anything. The people who were designing and building and buying those vehicles are all dead and gone. So is that market. I hope for not only survives but thrives but if they listen to what you guys want him to do and don't cover all bases they will not. I am not saying they should only make EVs but the idea is they should retrench and just make the same thing they've been making for 100 years is ridiculous. Do you only invest in one stock? Also my point is Kia and Hyundai were laughing stocks in this country just 20 years ago and look at where they're at now.

LOL for a smart man you come across as pretty ignorant or a narcissist. It's your way or no way with insults but no information that has credence. Still your posts are very amusing.

 

[Gonzo chris]

LOL for a smart man you come across as pretty ignorant or a narcissist. It's your way or no way with insults but no information that has credence. Still your posts are very amusing.

Ignorant means unknowledgeable you mean rude? Or narcissistic? Well then I guess you would probably vote for me I assume. You're calling me a troll and then you're referring to my manners? Simply because I disagree? I just looked up this link from Edmunds. I don't know if you call them fake news or not, but they say that the EV market share in the United States is currently 6.8% of new vehicle sales, which is a 1.6% improvement over 2022. Yet somehow you economics majors who always talk about the market describe that as a crash..... I'm glad you don't take care of my portfolio. If you don't want
me to be rude to you don't call me a troll https://www.edmunds.com/electric-car/articles/percentage-of-electric-cars-in-us.html#:~:text=The electric vehicle market share,according to Edmunds sales data.

 

[Hunters Edge]

Ignorant means unknowledgeable you mean rude? Or narcissistic? Well then I guess you would probably vote for me I assume. You're calling me a troll and then you're referring to my manners? Simply because I disagree? I just looked up this link from Edmunds. I don't know if you call them fake news or not, but they say that the EV market share in the United States is currently 6.8% of new vehicle sales, which is a 1.6% improvement over 2022. Yet somehow you economics majors who always talk about the market describe that as a crash..... I'm glad you don't take care of my portfolio. If you don't want
me to be rude to you don't call me a troll https://www.edmunds.com/electric-car/articles/percentage-of-electric-cars-in-us.html#:~:text=The electric vehicle market share,according to Edmunds sales data.

I didn't open or read the link but even a 1.6% increase is not profitable for one manufacturer let alone divided by how many EV manufacturers? That's a drop in the bucket of cars sold. It doesn't pay for the engineering, marketing and production. It might be why Ford is turning from EV to gas and hybrid.

If it walks like duck and sounds like a duck, I'll let you finish it. Besides you described yourself on another post not sure if in this thread, something about living under an overpass, or bridge.

 

[Gonzo chris]

I didn't open or read the link but even a 1.6% increase is not profitable for one manufacturer let alone divided by how many EV manufacturers? That's a drop in the bucket of cars sold. It doesn't pay for the engineering, marketing and production. It might be why Ford is turning from EV to gas and hybrid.

If it walks like duck and sounds like a duck, I'll let you finish it. Besides you described yourself on another post not sure if in this thread, something about living under an overpass, or bridge.

Huh? The market share is 1.6% higher which means the ICEV share is 1.6% LOWER in the United States specifically. Let alone the ROW. You can use all the old hillbilly colloquialisms you want it doesn't make you right. Ford's EVs need to be more competitive, you're looking at them as though they are the only manufacturer.

Of course if they're building new factories, or converting old ones, into making EVs when you factor that cost in they're not going to be immediately profitable. It's called investing in the future. How long did it take Ford to recoup the cost of their Rouge factory?

 

[Gonzo chris]

I didn't open or read the link but even a 1.6% increase is not profitable for one manufacturer let alone divided by how many EV manufacturers? That's a drop in the bucket of cars sold. It doesn't pay for the engineering, marketing and production. It might be why Ford is turning from EV to gas and hybrid.

If it walks like duck and sounds like a duck, I'll let you finish it. Besides you described yourself on another post not sure if in this thread, something about living under an overpass, or bridge.

Since you don't want to open a link that's as a percentage of US market. You're suggesting investing money only in the market (ICEV) segment that is shrinking is smart, I'm suggesting they should invest in both.

 

[Hunters Edge]

Huh? The market share is 1.6% higher which means the ICEV share is 1.6% LOWER in the United States specifically. Let alone the ROW. You can use all the old hillbilly colloquialisms you want it doesn't make you right. Ford's EVs need to be more competitive, you're looking at them as though they are the only manufacturer.

Of course if they're building new factories, or converting old ones, into making EVs when you factor that cost in they're not going to be immediately profitable. It's called investing in the future. How long did it take Ford to recoup the cost of their Rouge factory?

Since you don't want to open a link that's as a percentage of US market. You're suggesting investing money only in the market (ICEV) segment that is shrinking is smart, I'm suggesting they should invest in both.

You just don't get it. It's not investing if they don't recoup or better yet make it profitable in the time needed to be red. Besides they also have to make investors not only profitable but to increase shares and please shareholders. I believe I read they split ICE vs EV and they were 8 billion in the black. It's yet another reason they converted of changed there investment to ICE.

Hey if technology increases in EV it could very well take off. As it is it's an anchor, to many negatives. I say this I hope technology either paves the way for zero emissions and zero rare earth metals in EV and or ICE.

 

[Gonzo chris]

You just don't get it. It's not investing if they don't recoup or better yet make it profitable in the time needed to be red. Besides they also have to make investors not only profitable but to increase shares and please shareholders. I believe I read they split ICE vs EV and they were 8 billion in the black. It's yet another reason they converted of changed there investment to ICE.

Hey if technology increases in EV it could very well take off. As it is it's an anchor, to many negatives. I say this I hope technology either paves the way for zero emissions and zero rare earth metals in EV and or ICE.

I give up go turn your old black and white TV on. Sit back and watch I love Lucy.... First of all the big three are crying poor on EVS because they don't want to make them it's easier just to slap an ancient pushrod V8 with two valves per cylinder into a giant body on frame truck throw a bunch of fake Chrome on it and sell it to some suburban want to be country boy for $90,000. You don't get it even in the United States coming with you reference the EV market has gone up significantly as a percentage of the overall car market over the last 10 years. Even this year it's going up as a percentage but just not as quickly as predicted. If Ford had more competitive EVs and they were selling great they wouldn't be making this claim. The profitability is already there for many other car makers. They're using accounting tricks, basically selling if we build a brand new EV plant this year and then look at the amount of EVS we sell this year factoring the cost of the factory and the production we're not going to make a profit on them. Well of course they're not. Not initially.
As for the rare earth metals they're not exactly rare. It's just that they weren't heavily mined for us so they were rare, relatively so, regarding availability in the market. Of course we all hope for batteries that use less materials or ones that are fully recyclable. Gasoline isn't recyclable unless you count when it enters your lungs

 

[Hunters Edge]

I give up go turn your old black and white TV on. Sit back and watch I love Lucy.... First of all the big three are crying poor on EVS because they don't want to make them it's easier just to slap an ancient pushrod V8 with two valves per cylinder into a giant body on frame truck throw a bunch of fake Chrome on it and sell it to some suburban want to be country boy for $90,000. You don't get it even in the United States coming with you reference the EV market has gone up significantly as a percentage of the overall car market over the last 10 years. Even this year it's going up as a percentage but just not as quickly as predicted. If Ford had more competitive EVs and they were selling great they wouldn't be making this claim. The profitability is already there for many other car makers. They're using accounting tricks, basically selling if we build a brand new EV plant this year and then look at the amount of EVS we sell this year factoring the cost of the factory and the production we're not going to make a profit on them. Well of course they're not. Not initially.
As for the rare earth metals they're not exactly rare. It's just that they weren't heavily mined for us so they were rare, relatively so, regarding availability in the market. Of course we all hope for batteries that use less materials or ones that are fully recyclable. Gasoline isn't recyclable unless you count when it enters your lungs

Your analogy is incorrect. Your trying to spin reality to your twisted thinking. Going from black and white TV to color is definitely an improvement. Going from ICE to EV is going backwards in convenience, performance and more importantly safety. Below is is a better analogy.

 

[Gonzo chris]

Your analogy is incorrect. Your trying to spin reality to your twisted thinking. Going from black and white TV to color is definitely an improvement. Going from ICE to EV is going backwards in convenience, performance and more importantly safety. Below is is a better analogy.

It depends on your metrics. Again, I'm not an EV fanatic. I'm just not like you with a brain that has ossified. Even someone with your limited technological knowledge on the subject would certainly know that things like range and battery technology are leaps and bounds better than they were when GM came out with their ev1. They are now EVS that go 500 mi on a charge. Now you don't need to tell me that if you're in the polar circle and it's -20° and there's no chargers around. What are you going to do, we know there are gas stations on every corner up there right? I understand All technologies have pluses and minuses. We have not seen anywhere near the same technological improvements in ice in the last few decades. Yes, they have continued to get better but we already got the low-hanging fruit. I will acknowledge they're not the best for certain people out here , like my buddy in Ohio, who drive 200,000 mi a year towing in the boonies But for the vast majority of people who live in the suburbs and don't drive more than 400 mi everyday, they don't worry about getting home. You know you drive home from work and you plug it in when you get home.
How often do you drive more than 500 mi without stopping?. Being open-minded isn't twisted thinking it's actually admirable. But I understand most of the people I know are like you. They figured out what they like 30 years ago and that's it
So what would the mileage breakthrough be before you were comfortable.? Like if they had a solid state battery that could go 1,500 MI on a charge? Would you feel okay with tha or would ride around all white knuckle on your 5-mile trip to the supermarket?
I understand range anxiety. I've thought about it myself but like most anxieties and as Mark Twain said: most of the things I spent my life worrying about never happened...

 

[Gonzo chris]

Your analogy is incorrect. Your trying to spin reality to your twisted thinking. Going from black and white TV to color is definitely an improvement. Going from ICE to EV is going backwards in convenience, performance and more importantly safety. Below is is a better analogy.

Performance? You know EVs are pretty quick? Like 0-60 in less than 3 seconds in a 4 door sedan? Personally I'd rather drive a Porsche 911 gt3 with a manual for fun but they are quick

 

[Gonzo chris]

Oh, and from what I read, just saw an article on CNBC, Ford's excessive warranty costs and inability to make a dependable product after 130 years seems to be what's draining their bank account the most. Thankfully, it looks as though they're working on addressing that, or at least talking about it.

 

[Hunters Edge]

Oh, and from what I read, just saw an article on CNBC, Ford's excessive warranty costs and inability to make a dependable product after 130 years seems to be what's draining their bank account the most. Thankfully, it looks as though they're working on addressing that, or at least talking about it.

Not discounting the severity of the issue. You should have done a little better research, Ford is not the only one with quality issues. Several articles of Toyota not being able to sell Tacoma's, also dealerships not accepting trade in of them etc etc. It's an issue all auto manufacturers are dealing with unfortunately. On a side note I read an article earlier in the year that Ford had more older vehicles still being driven or daily drivers than other manufacturers. Again it is an issue, on the bright side, Ford is fixing them and owning up to the issue. That's not the case with other auto manufacturers.

 

[Gonzo chris]

Not discounting the severity of the issue. You should have done a little better research, Ford is not the only one with quality issues. Several articles of Toyota not being able to sell Tacoma's, also dealerships not accepting trade in of them etc etc. It's an issue all auto manufacturers are dealing with unfortunately. On a side note I read an article earlier in the year that Ford had more older vehicles still being driven or daily drivers than other manufacturers. Again it is an issue, on the bright side, Ford is fixing them and owning up to the issue. That's not the case with other auto manufacturers.

Hopefully they're fixing that issue. I read they spent over $1 billion on warranty claims. To be honest, the only thing, besides not wanting another car payment right now with a kid ready to go to college in a year, from getting a Maverick is a lot of what I've read out here. I take it with a grain of salt cuz I know you hear the horror stories more on forums but still. As for older ones being driven, that might have something to do with the customer base as well. Who knows? I feel like in particular with pickup trucks you might get more guys keeping them longer

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