Converting Hybrid to a plug in hybrid...

[dochawk]

I think it would be easier and you would be money ahead by converting a plug-in Ford Escape to an open bed.

variants on this theme are replacing the computer and enough parts of the maverick powertrain with battery to make it things that it's an Escape, or putting a Maverick body on and Escape.

But these things tend to be insanely expensive. Start with buying one of each, and . . .

as another issue, I'm not aware of any non-plugin that has enough of a battery to be worth trying to charge with a plug.

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[The Real Maverick]

Where is that stated that it's due to max speed of the generator motor?

I've got a cold weather log file showing 8584 happened to be the max RPM on that generator motor during a drive. Neg 2749 other side max.

Max RPM on the traction motor happened to be 7223 rpm in this log file.
Speed at that point was 58 mph.
ICE 1962 rpm. Already on and stayed on entire time.
Generator motor 54 rpm.
(and during that speed right then GM ranged from 4391 to neg 2749 for purposes of gearing and power request).

That max GM 8584 rpm was @ 42 mph, ICE 3914 rpm, TM 5307 rpm.
(torque at that moment was ICE 114 and TM 71 ft-lbs. So pushing it.)

The switch happens indeed because of design, and we all know that is at a call above abouts 10% power on the Go pedal.
That can happen at fast speed or low speed - and the GM is indeed spinning opposite the TM, at whatever high or low RPM that happens to be at the time. Except for spinning up the ICE.

So I'm wondering how the system is doing that to protect the GM max RPM?
Since I've had the EV mode @ 65 mph before maintaining speed, TM has to be above that 7223 RPM, and therefore GM is going to be neg that same RPM so the ICE isn't engaged.

So I really don't see how engaging ICE at 10% power call or above is saving the GM rpm from high speeds that are much higher rpm from higher speed use of the TM.

I agree though settings to attempt to recharge a bigger/secondary battery pack by overspinning the motors not a good idea, just let them do what they can.
Hey, at least you wouldn't have to engage ICE braking if battery space to shove more power to!

I thought you and I already discussed this at length before.

Remember?

The EV power you get is (weak) due to current (amperage) limitation, coupled with the fact while driving on electric alone (traction motor only pulling amps) enough reserve current needs to be withheld for simultaneous starting of the engine while providing forward motion.

Also EV is possible to 80 MPH (that I have seen going downhill).

IIRC the ratio is 125 rpm per MPH with stock tires.

This is 10,000 rpm at 80 mph.

But since the truck can go ~105 MPH
Top rpm for the traction motor is somewhere above 13,000 RPM.

 

[SloopJB]

do you have to add fuel stabilizer in the RAV4?

No. We burn enough fuel. Everytime I go on 287 or I35 I will run it on the engine for at least 10 miles. It ran great on the trip to Scottsdale last month.

 

[SloopJB]

Try researching RAV4 Prime.

 

[converseguy]

I have a 2023 Maverick Hybrid but my other car is a 2024 Prius. When I looked into getting a Prius Prime (PHEV) I did the math and found that the $5000.00 premium for the prime would have taken me ten years to break even given my 16 mile RT commute and that I get free electricity at work. Just wasn't worth it. The math would be the same for a PHEV Maverick.

 

[wax87]

I have a 2023 Maverick Hybrid but my other car is a 2024 Prius. When I looked into getting a Prius Prime (PHEV) I did the math and found that the $5000.00 premium for the prime would have taken me ten years to break even given my 16 mile RT commute and that I get free electricity at work. Just wasn't worth it. The math would be the same for a PHEV Maverick.

How much of that $5,000 is for the actual engineering, component and installation cost and how much is just Prime badging cost?

 

[converseguy]

How much of that $5,000 is for the actual engineering, component and installation cost and how much is just Prime badging cost?

I have no idea. I only care about how much that $5000.00 affects my bank account.

 

[wax87]

I have no idea. I only care about how much that $5000.00 affects my bank account.

Agree on that for sure

 

[SP1966]

"You're so preoccupied with whether or not you could, you didn't stop to think if you should.”

— Ian Malcolm

 

[HeyBales]

I thought you and I already discussed this at length before.

Remember?

The EV power you get is (weak) due to current (amperage) limitation, coupled with the fact while driving on electric alone (traction motor only pulling amps) enough reserve current needs to be withheld for simultaneous starting of the engine while providing forward motion.

Also EV is possible to 80 MPH (that I have seen going downhill).

IIRC the ratio is 125 rpm per MPH with stock tires.

This is 10,000 rpm at 80 mph.

But since the truck can go ~105 MPH
Top rpm for the traction motor is somewhere above 13,000 RPM.

Oh indeed I recalled the principle, if not the figures. It's why the statement of bringing on the ICE to protect the generator motor just didn't make sense on the surface, not at the speeds that's going to happen.

So indeed, the generator motor to match the traction motor going 10K rpm, is 10K.
So that example trip I had the log file was showing above 8500 on GM @ 42 mph was almost there already, and that was merely for purpose of gearing, not EV mode TM matching.

So the idea that the system drops the EV mode to protect the GM from a high rpm just isn't the case.

Whenever I see someone comment the EV is dropped at 25 or 35, instead of 10% power - I know they just haven't been observing gauges. Now with the 25MY, it appears no % is given so it'll be a worse association to speed instead of power.

 

[The Real Maverick]

In the older generations of Ford Escape Hybrids the MG1 and MG2 ratio was not 1:1.

In generation one for example, the top EV speed was 40 mph, and indeed was to limit top speed of the generator.

Different beast. Different time. But that's where that idea came from.

 

[Rparry]

I learned about the max RPM of MG1 from WeberAuto. When running on only electric drive the way planetary gears work MG1 is turned in an overdrive condition. When the gas engine starts it changes the way the planetary gear set works and lowers the RPM of the MG1. Check out WeberAuto on YouTube it has a lot of engineering tear downs and info.

 

[HeyBales]

I learned about the max RPM of MG1 from WeberAuto. When running on only electric drive the way planetary gears work MG1 is turned in an overdrive condition. When the gas engine starts it changes the way the planetary gear set works and lowers the RPM of the MG1. Check out WeberAuto on YouTube it has a lot of engineering tear downs and info.

Seen the videos. He does a good job distinguishing between Toyota that uses MG1 & MG2 terms, and Ford using Generator & Traction motor terms.

Overdrive?

Reverse of normal mode spin direction, not overdrive. Maybe you mean the planetary gear, and overdrive meaning like a transmission aspect.
And actually it's an electric motor - not really a "reverse" except what it would be called for clarity.

GM is spun the same speed as the TM when in EV mode, just the opposite direction. So that's the 10K rpm mentioned in post above.
That way there is no spin going to the engine from the planetary gear. (well, unless needed for engine braking on too much regen from TM)

After the GM spins up the engine while moving by spinning different RPM, or from standstill, the GM spins at a speed needed for gearing ratio needed.

As I mentioned in my post - during a drive it's hitting 8500 rpm for gearing with engine running, almost the 10K used for 80 mph EV use.

So the concept the engine is run in order to lower the GM rpm is not true, it can be lower, it can be "reverse", it can be just as high as in EV use. It's not going to be spun faster than it's rated, just needs to not be called to do so. So there is an upper gearing limit, where engine RPM will now rise out of the sweet spot zone if you keep going faster.

To Real Maverick's reminder - the actual reason the engine is brought on during a drive (outside of for heat or battery recharge), not because of speed, not because of high motor rpm, but because of max amps that can be sent to the traction motor thru the system. So that's the abouts 10% power limit that can be seen on prior to MY25 power gauge.
Once the power request from the Go pedal exceeds that amp limit - the engine is needed.

 

[tom_tucker]

I have no idea. I only care about how much that $5000.00 affects my bank account.

And that 5k invested will be an asset possibly worth 10k by the time you make up the difference.

I have a 2023 Maverick Hybrid but my other car is a 2024 Prius. When I looked into getting a Prius Prime (PHEV) I did the math and found that the $5000.00 premium for the prime would have taken me ten years to break even given my 16 mile RT commute and that I get free electricity at work. Just wasn't worth it. The math would be the same for a PHEV Maverick.

It's the same reason for not upgrading in general to a 2025 AWD. When you add the lost income from the extra 10k spent, I might as well just save up for a 2030 Maverick.

 

[urwatuis]

I've read this is possible with some hybrids but wondering if anyone has heard of it done with a maverick. Since I drive mostly locally I'd love to be able to get 20-30 miles without the ICE kicking in.

Anyone?

Maybe it could be done if buy a used PHEV Prius and get the Toyota parts to work with the Ford? just throwing it out there for thought.

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