UAW and Ford reach tentative agreement

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[Barracuda340]

My thoughts on this. I think someone screwing a car together should get decent pay, but let's be realistic about this. All that $40 an hour is going to do is offshore more of the domestic manufacturing to mexico. Case in point, GMs legacy costs add roughly $7,000 to each vehicle currently made. So let's say I'm 18 and get a job for GM sticking carpets in Buicks. I do that for 20 years and retire with medical bennies and a pension till I die. I can walk out of there at 38 years old, done my 20. GM is obligated to pay that pension till I croak. Sounds like a sweet deal if you ask me. Those pensions are the legacy costs. People live into their 70s and 80s now.

Full size pickup trucks are now between $50k to $100K. Plus the 16% - 18% interest rates on borrowers, and these vehicles will not sell. They sure as hell arent going to sell when the prices get hiked even higher to cover these costs. This will eventually force cut backs on the lines and plant closures. Not to mention dealers doing fire sales all the time to ditch the unsold iron. This works short term, but long term your dealer network dies out. Specifically the smaller dealerships in the smaller towns. This forces people to either drive to a bigger city to get their vehicle or just buy whatever else is local because of necessary maintenance and warranty. I call this killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.

I live in Texas, or fly over country as its known to you east and west coasters. Sometimes the distance to the next town with a dealership is 1.5 to 2 hour drive one way. Most people are not going to do that. They will buy what's local. And that's how you lose your nameplate presence and dealership network in small towns.

But hey maybe the japanese will buy them shuttered U.S. plants to make more Tokyo Tonkas here. I bet they will be non union then. I tend to maintain and keep my vehicles a looooong time. I'm still driving my 94 silverado i also bought new, and that's pushing 30 years now. I'm 55 and both this maverick and my wifes impala are payed off. I will maintain them both for the next 20 years. No need for anymore cars for us. Good luck with your future plant closings UAW. Your gonna need it.

 

[Subsailortrainman]

Vehicle prices just went up 3 grand. If you can’t afford a 75000 dollar F150, a 78000 dollar F150 won’t be in your future either. Union leadership is going to regret this decision. Possibly in the near future.

 

[grumpyguy]

And athletes getting in excess of 62 million per year and creating nothing. Your point is?

 

[Maverstang]

Interesting chart… definitely shows wealth inequality is mainly an American problem.

Here is another one that shows we are almost back to the robber baron days of the early 20th century:

What I find most extraordinary is how one party has managed to hoodwink the poorest Americans into continuing to vote for even more tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. It is blatantly obvious we have a tax collection problem more than a spending problem.

 

[Skyline]

Yep, members usually vote what UAW Reps recommend.

Yeah, it is unlikely that the union members would not vote for the contract with Ford. Here are the highlight of the agreed upon, but yet to be voted on new contract:

https://uaw.org/uaw-auto-bargaining/fordcontract/

This will put the other two car manufacturers in a pickle....

 

[MagnusBjorn]

Interesting chart… definitely shows wealth inequality is mainly an American problem.

Here is another one that shows we are almost back to the robber baron days of the early 20th century:

What I find most extraordinary is how one party has managed to hoodwink the poorest Americans into continuing to vote for even more tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. It is blatantly obvious we have a tax collection problem more than a spending problem.

I find it extraordinary that some people hoodwinked people into thinking they deserve to sit back and be paid for other's hard work. I do agree rich are getting richer but people are getting poorer because they are happy to sit back and do nothing for a small amount of money. Most rich people are rich because of sacrifice and hard work. The top 1% pay over 40% of the tax base in this country while 50% pay 0.

 

[Barracuda340]

And athletes getting in excess of 62 million per year and creating nothing. Your point is?

I dont watch sports, therefore I dont contribute to that problem. My hobbies involve restoring antique Chrysler cars, G scale model trains and playing with HO scale slot cars.

Sports are nothing but a diversion tactic that the government uses to their advantage. The Romans did it as well. The Huns are bashing down the gates, oh it's all good, just go to the games, be happy, be well, watch the Christians get eaten by lions. Nothing to see here.

 

[Barracuda340]

I find it extraordinary that one party hoodwinked people into thinking they deserve to sit back and be paid for other's hard work. I do agree rich are getting richer but people are getting poorer because they are happy to sit back and do nothing for a small amount of money. Most rich people are rich because of sacrifice and hard work. The top 1% pay over 40% of the tax base in this country while 50% pay 0.

I know where I stand in regards to politics, and I'm not a fan of Ole Sniffer. But I will say this, the mods on this site will squash this thread like a bug if it gets out of hand. I got 2 strikes already. One more I get kicked out. I like the MTC and dont want to get kicked out. Though I wish there was some way i can lose the 2 strikes through being a good boy for 12 months.

 

[Maverstang]

I find it extraordinary that one party hoodwinked people into thinking they deserve to sit back and be paid for other's hard work. I do agree rich are getting richer but people are getting poorer because they are happy to sit back and do nothing for a small amount of money. Most rich people are rich because of sacrifice and hard work. The top 1% pay over 40% of the tax base in this country while 50% pay 0.

Essentially you have just validated the inequality problem. If the poorer people were paid more, they would then have to pay taxes and have some skin in the game. Instead the wealthy are happy to keep them below the line and out of the dialog, using hate and anger to wind them up when it suits their purpose.

 

[zeen]

“The agreement grants 25% in base wage increases through April 2028, and will cumulatively raise the top wage by over 30% to more than $40 an hour, and raise the starting wage by 68%, to over $28 an hour.”

The reason they were so focussed on closing the gap between the starting wage and top wage is not to make it more fair to the new hires. It's so the the top tier is not constantly reminded that they could be easily replaced tomorrow by someone making half as much. I don't begrudge anyone a good living, but I have witnessed the UAW's laziness, featherbedding and disloyalty my whole life. They have systematically driven the Detroit Three's market share down and into fewer and fewer niches. This is just another step in the death spiral. Toyota makes a decent truck. To the extent all the companies draw from the same supply base, the biggest cost differentiator is labor cost and productivity. And it's not even close.

 

[MagnusBjorn]

Essentially you have just validated the inequality problem. If the poorer people were paid more, they would then have to pay taxes and have some skin in the game. Instead the wealthy are happy to keep them below the line and out of the dialog, using hate and anger to wind them up when it suits their purpose.

Feel free to start a business and pay your employees anything that you want. There are no employers that force people to work for them, and if the money isn't good, then move on. Nature is cruel too, and nothing is free, but hard work almost always pays off. Why should they pay people more than the job is worth? $20 to flip a burger at a fast food joint hasn't worked out well, and they have started to replace people with kiosks. High pay scales on low-skilled jobs will lead to offshoring or automation. Not all of us are equal, even if people want to pretend that we are, and some people are more capable and get paid more. I'm not sharp enough to be a lawyer or doctor, but I have worked hard and made a decent living for my family.

 

[Barracuda340]

Essentially you have just validated the inequality problem. If the poorer people were paid more, they would then have to pay taxes and have some skin in the game. Instead the wealthy are happy to keep them below the line and out of the dialog, using hate and anger to wind them up when it suits their purpose.

Work hard, get an education in something worthwhile that will afford you the lifestyle you want and dont squander your money. I am a 3rd generation American born in my family. I can trace my roots of my great grandparents back to Warsaw Poland on my mothers side, and Sicily Italy on my pops side. My great grandparents on both sides struggled, and each successive generation did better than the next. Most of it had to do with education. IMHO college is an absolute waste and nothing more than a money pit/liberal indoctrination center.

I went into the blue collar trades along with both my brothers. Mine was aviation maintenance. I work for a regional carrier doing heavy mtx sheetmetal structures repair. My first 15 years with the company I practically lived up there. Lived dirt broke poor, but my Student loans got payed off in 5 years, home payed off in 12 years in a nice neighborhood.

I have seen guys doing the same as far as working hours and blow it all on bullshit and have nothing to show for it. I have been with the same company 28 years. As a matter of fact as I moved up the ladder, theres a guy who now works for me in my department now that started 6 months after me. Dude has declared bankruptcy, lives in a single wide trailer, and drives a 13 year old hyundai.

Point is, you have one life. It's all how you navigate it and take good care to make the right decisions. I like nice things + I dont want to work till I'm dead. I dont have a pension plan from my employer, and I believe social security will be done and over with before I reach retirement.

That being said, all along knowing this was looming. I lived dirt broke poor to put money into an IRA, and pay my home off early so I could double down on my IRA. 7 years from now, I will walk away at age 63. That will be 35 years of drilling and hammering on rivets, and crawling around on my hands and knees changing out corroded to shit logistics tracks inside fuselages. That's enough for me. If social security is still around, then that's just a bonus, but I'm not going to have to work till age 67&1/2 to get it. I will retire before then.

 

[2023Maverick]

Time to raise the prices up! One of the reasons I purchased a Maverick was because it was assembled in Mexico. I am for the American worker, but the union American worker don’t want to work for their current pay. Ever notice road workers? 2 are working and 5 are standing around. I see it everyday. Last union made vehicle “Jeep “ I purchased was an absolute piece of crap. Bolts were not even fully threaded in. Was falling apart with low mileage. Quality union made vehicles do not exist now. They can have their baby sitter union.

 

[azadv]

I hope they get close to it.

yeah, that’s fair

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