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[CTYankee]

IMHO, there are some flaws in OP's original post. First is casting aspersions on vendors specific to this forum when, in reality, it's just as easy to urge people to do their due diligence with any seller, storefront or online.

Second, by not providing any specific information to support his complaint, we can't judge if his complaint is reasonable.

Lasfit is a case in point. It's difficult to engineer a product that relies on third-party software to function properly if that software is itself problematic. Holding Lasfit accountable for hyper-flashing after a Ford recall is performed on the software isn't reasonable. But hyper-flashing due to extended signaling that results in overheating is something they can and should correct. To me, it's a minor issue because it's only happened once in nearly 3 years so I wouldn't make a public complaint about it but I don't live in Texas, either, where it might happen a lot more frequently.

So provide specifics and be fair about what is or is not reasonable.

Stealing designs is not an accusation that should be levelled without specific knowledge, which I doubt OP has. I don't care who is selling what on Etsy. If it's not a patented design or covered by trademark, it's in the public domain and anyone can reproduce it. That's not stealing.

https://answers.justia.com/question...legally sell,designs or violating any patents.

Finally, no one should claim misrepresentation without providing the claim made and how reality differed from the claim. When I owned my retail store, I dealt with occasional customers who outright lied about conversations and others who misunderstood what they were told. A good seller can deal with the latter, but there isn't much one can do with the former.

All of this to say, just be an honest reporter rather than a stone thrower. You'll get more support.

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[RichardCranium]

I was referring to the tailgate covers that people had designed and sold 3D printed versions of that Mabbett stole.

He is right though, a lot of Etsy sellers just drop ship. Etsy does not uphold their terms of service because if they closed the accounts of all of these drop shippers, then they would make less money. This is coming from a person that sells on Etsy.
Amazon has the same problem. People will sell things on amazon as “shipped and sold from US” and then when it ships the tracking is china post. You complain to amazon and they try to sweep it under the rug. I was told by one representative that the seller is indeed located in San Diego, ca. and that they must have entered the tracking information wrong. When I finally did receive it, it had the customs declaration on it and the Chinese postage. Amazon doesn’t care because they make money off of them.
oh, and be careful on what maverick stuff you by off Etsy as well, people just take the designs off thingiverse or other 3D printer websites and sell them without giving credit where credit is due. This happened to one of our members who designed the 2 piece tailgate hole cover. His design was taken from thingiverse and someone is selling it on Etsy.

 

[RichardCranium]

Stealing designs is not an accusation that should be levelled without specific knowledge, which I doubt OP has. I don't care who is selling what on Etsy. If it's not a patented design or covered by trademark, it's in the public domain and anyone can reproduce it. That's not stealing.

https://answers.justia.com/question...legally sell,designs or violating any patents.

Ok, stealing may be a strong word for it, but here is what I consider stealing, taking something that isn’t yours. Obviously @P99Guy have no legal claim over the tailgate cover because we did not patent it. However, we did design it and our design is covered under copyright. Still, it isn’t the design they are selling, and again, no legal support for that. What did happen is, Mabett took a design that we made and had a strong following for, and made a lower quality product. Because they chose to do that, I can choose not to purchase their products and I can tell other people not to purchase their products. What I am saying is not a lie, so I am within my rights to say it. I am not breaking the law, like they are not. My product was designed and available to the public, prior to their design, and if they can prove to me that they started their design BEFORE my first rendering was published, then I will retract all statements and stop commenting on their immoral business practices. Until then, I will continue not only to not purchase their products but also recommend that others don’t as well.
And what you said is incorrect about public domain. Designs are protected by copyright. If someone was manufacturing something from my exact designs, then they are in violation of that copyright. However, if they produce something that is not patented that they designed themselves or modified the design enough that it was not exactly like the design l, they following the law. Unfortunately for me, Mabett is in the right in terms of the law, so I have no case against them, but I still am of the opinion that it is an immoral business practice and so therefore I choose not to do business with them.

 

[Timothyd]

I gotta say this post is rather sad. Not that I haven’t called out a company for false or misleading. That being said that is what the forums is for.
If a vendor says something not true challenge them in that thread. Not on a random post that really can only be seen as damaging to the company.
Yes you listed the names but you really should give details of said reasons. Otherwise a quick search can lead to this post and you lumped a bunch of companies together.
I’d like to know specifically what the grievances are. Quality, honesty, timeline for parts?
I’ve only ever interacted with one of them. Fast mavericks. Have not purchased yet and we certainly don’t agree on everything but that is all hashed out in said forum. I’ve never seen him offer a bad product.

Well, they make the group, as it is, possible. Nothing is free.

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

IMHO, there are some flaws in OP's original post. First is casting aspersions on vendors specific to this forum when, in reality, it's just as easy to urge people to do their due diligence with any seller, storefront or online.

Second, by not providing any specific information to support his complaint, we can't judge if his complaint is reasonable.
Since the Advent of the internet and forms such as these. Part of my due diligence is actually coming to these forms and seeing if there's any reviews, good or bad about a product I'm looking to buy. Having the product or the company name is essential. GB.LLC

All of this to say, just be an honest reporter rather than a stone thrower. You'll get more support.

When I was in the vinyl decal industry. The department I was in we used 3M marking vinyl (think the Raptor decal)
specifically. You want to decal like that to be as thin and as close to paint as possible. We would get people complaining that the vinyl was too thin. The customer didn't think it would hold up well or wouldn't stick.
Here are two different examples of our vinyl. Red is 3M marking vinyl and I don't really recall off the top of my head what brand the gold one was.
I applied these more than 10 years ago on my coffee cup that I use daily and goes through a dishwasher.
You decide whether the vinyl is holding up or not.

Take care.

GB
Yes , only one cup of coffee a day now.

 

[CTYankee]

And what you said is incorrect about public domain. Designs are protected by copyright. If someone was manufacturing something from my exact designs, then they are in violation of that copyright. However, if they produce something that is not patented that they designed themselves or modified the design enough that it was not exactly like the design l, they following the law. Unfortunately for me, Mabett is in the right in terms of the law, so I have no case against them, but I still am of the opinion that it is an immoral business practice and so therefore I choose not to do business with them.

Obviously, I'm not a lawyer and don't want to play one on TV. That's why I included the link in my post and that article does include copyrighted designs, as you noted.

What remains unclear is if Mabett modified your design. Your comment that they "are in the right in terms of the law" suggests they did, or else they would be in violation of your copyright.

I'll also guess from your other comments that they've mostly just made it cheaper in both cost and quality. The term "Chinese knockoff" comes to mind. It would be interesting to know if that, by itself, is enough to not violate your copyright.

 

[CTYankee]

For clarity, the red underlined comments in the quote within @Glen Baker LLC's post above were not in my original comments. They've been added to the quote.

He makes a good point. It's why I am a loyal customer of 3M adhesive products. I don't care if they are more expensive; they just work. It's also why, when I'm comparing prices, that I don't look at just the price. I will often buy a more expensive product if I can see some reason for the price difference.

Although @RichardCranium's product might be more expensive, I'd probably buy that if I can see the extra value in his version of the product. Purely economic buyers tend to look only at price.

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

For clarity, the red underlined comments in the quote within @Glen Baker LLC's post above were not in my original comments. They've been added to the quote.

He makes a good point. It's why I am a loyal customer of 3M adhesive products. I don't care if they are more expensive; they just work. It's also why, when I'm comparing prices, that I don't look at just the price. I will often buy a more expensive product if I can see some reason for the price difference.

Although @RichardCranium's product might be more expensive, I'd probably buy that if I can see the extra value in his version of the product. Purely economic buyers tend to look only at price.

Hence, why I put them in Red and underlined.
Fixed it.

GB
No trademarks or copyrights have been infringed.

 

[Silver23]

I have to agree with you. I started using LASFIT lights around January of 2022. I had a couple that had quit within the one year. On the warranty, and they were replaced right away.

These could be under the "overpriced" category. Just sayin'

 

[P99Guy]

I just want to add my 2 cents.
take it as you will.
In as many of the Original Design Covers that I have sold there has been only 1 order for all 4 different covers.
that order was to an individual in California.
I thought it was odd at the time but to each his own.
Amazingly the Mabett cover appeared on Amazon about 2 months later.
coincidence?

 

[Glen Baker LLC]

.

I sent you a pm.
GB

 

[RichardCranium]

Obviously, I'm not a lawyer and don't want to play one on TV. That's why I included the link in my post and that article does include copyrighted designs, as you noted.

What remains unclear is if Mabett modified your design. Your comment that they "are in the right in terms of the law" suggests they did, or else they would be in violation of your copyright.

I'll also guess from your other comments that they've mostly just made it cheaper in both cost and quality. The term "Chinese knockoff" comes to mind. It would be interesting to know if that, by itself, is enough to not violate your copyright.

You are correct, they are not in violation of copyright to my understanding. From what I can tell, the design is modified, and it is probably modified at least to the extent that it does not fall under copyright infringement. If they did, being a very small business, I do not have the means to try and fight it anyways.
unfortunately for those of us here, it is companies like Mabett that keep me from posting my designs online. I have been burned before, and so I do not share my design files any more.

 

[RichardCranium]

For clarity, the red underlined comments in the quote within @Glen Baker LLC's post above were not in my original comments. They've been added to the quote.

He makes a good point. It's why I am a loyal customer of 3M adhesive products. I don't care if they are more expensive; they just work. It's also why, when I'm comparing prices, that I don't look at just the price. I will often buy a more expensive product if I can see some reason for the price difference.

Although @RichardCranium's product might be more expensive, I'd probably buy that if I can see the extra value in his version of the product. Purely economic buyers tend to look only at price.

Yes, it does cost more but many have returned the Mabett version due to difficulty installing and bad fit. That being said, @P99Guy builds, distributes and provides amazing customer service.
I agree that 3M products are amazing and I am willing to pay more for them, which is why I would also be willing to buy the original cover, if I was in the market.
@P99Guy builds these things to order and sells them for An amazing price which includes shipping with tracking, but unfortunately, because we are not fulfilled by amazon, shipping costs are rather high. I do not make anything off of the design (I was planning on selling on Etsy, but my printer is not good enough to produce a high enough quality product), and @P99Guy makes enough to cover his materials. We never intended on becoming millionaires off the design. David felt it is a product that is very much needed and wants to make sure that everyone that wants one, has one.

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