Slip sliding away

[Cherokee]

'22 XLT FX4, running Blizzaks in Western New York winters. Throw on slippery mode and turn off traction control, rarely need to slow down. Blasts through the driveway without a problem.

I drove a Ford Fairlane, a RWD station wagon back in the early 80’s on roads like that pictured.
No traction control no antilock brakes., all season tires.
I was perfectly happy. Never had a problem.

Ice is always a problem but not loosely packed snow.

Anyone remember the lost art of brake pumping ?

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[Master Blaster]

Nothing wrong with that, for me cars always got a female name, I am feeling Michelle for mine but I haven't come to a firm decision on that. I also totally forgot about Tremors and how its the same spelling for the Tremor Maverick, I loved Burt in those movies, I think I watched all of them at least 4 times. Even the later ones made by the Sci-Fi channel.

Just out of interest, why are you disabling traction control? That should only be necessary when trying to spin your way out of a really bad situation and will decrease traction in most circumstances.

 

[Cherokee]

Just out of interest, why are you disabling traction control? That should only be necessary when trying to spin your way out of a really bad situation and will decrease traction in most circumstances.

Not true, Traction control helps in slippery conditions IF and only IF it’s not too bad.
Like wet roads, helps a little with lower speed hydroplaning,

As soon as I slip the second time On anything muddy or cruddy I turn it off,
Oddly I slip less and I move forward faster.

 

[MaverickDragon]

@Cherokee - It's actually not odd at all.
Traction control does help in those situations you noted.

In very slippery conditions, traction control is trying to put power where the wheels aren't slipping.
When all of them are slipping, it doesn't help, and it hurts by dropping power and/or using braking to try to control the wheel spin, and that only makes the situation worse.

Like you, I always turn off traction control on my very frequent forays into the silt mud that makes up the road once I leave my driveway.
In mud, traction control is an automated method to help you get stuck.

As far as the OP's complaint, the adage "where the rubber meets the road" is the actual issue.
A car's performance is limited by its contact patches, and most OEM tires are designed to seem adequate on a test ride, which typically doesn't include snow on ice.

 

[Rogan]

I live in northern IL and I agree stock tires do not cut in the snow ! Mine are Michelin's. Getting new Cooper Discovery Road and Trails installed today on my 2024 XLT Hybrid. Hoping for the best

 

[chrisofpa]

Just out of interest, why are you disabling traction control? That should only be necessary when trying to spin your way out of a really bad situation and will decrease traction in most circumstances.

Well for example, at the end of my street, I have a steep hill to climb going home. A couple times in the past I had traction control cut power on my car and get me stranded on the hill, other times I almost didnt make it due to loss of power. They're a few places up in my area like this, my old Chevy Sonic with the snow tires got caught often in these cases and I had to back down to get a running start to make it.

My Fusion doesn't have a traction control off button which I find quite vexing but with AWD and those CrossClimate 2 tires, its not a big deal.

 

[Ryom]

TCS is there to tell you to get better tires or find another route.

 

[Master Blaster]

Well for example, at the end of my street, I have a steep hill to climb going home. A couple times in the past I had traction control cut power on my car and get me stranded on the hill, other times I almost didnt make it due to loss of power. They're a few places up in my area like this, my old Chevy Sonic with the snow tires got caught often in these cases and I had to back down to get a running start to make it.

My Fusion doesn't have a traction control off button which I find quite vexing but with AWD and those CrossClimate 2 tires, its not a big deal.

That's a wacko place to build a house. I'd bet that you eat a lot of tires doing that.

My 2013 Fusion did have a TCS-off button, so I'm not sure why yours omitted it.

 

[chrisofpa]

That's a wacko place to build a house. I'd bet that you eat a lot of tires doing that.

My 2013 Fusion did have a TCS-off button, so I'm not sure why yours omitted it.

It's not that bad, I actually often get over 50,000 miles on my tires but the Poconos gets some nasty roads in the winters with the snow/ice. As for my Fusion, I have a 2019 and I never managed to find a TCS off button unlike my other cars.

 

[boatman]

It's snowing hard, had a out an inch already this morning. I was going to a car part swap meet. None of our roads have been plowed or salted. 24 eb/awd set to "slippery", factory tires with 11k on them. I spun on every corner even at 3 mph. I'm not getting how some in here claim it's so grippy in snow.

Not going to get much traction on an inch of snow, 3-4 inches would be better

 

[Cherokee]

I live in northern IL and I agree stock tires do not cut in the snow ! Mine are Michelin's. Getting new Cooper Discovery Road and Trails installed today on my 2024 XLT Hybrid. Hoping for the best

I’m hoping to get through the remainder of this winter with my stock Michelins.

At 13,500 miles now and they are still knee deep in tread. I’d like to go another 10-12,000 miles.

 

[Master Blaster]

I’m hoping to get through the remainder of this winter with my stock Michelins.

At 13,500 miles now and they are still knee deep in tread. I’d like to go another 10-12,000 miles.

If you check the UQOT numbers on the sidewall, the Michelins are rated for 60k normal driving before reaching the 2/32nds replacement indicators. The people who are not getting that are either on very poor roads or are very aggressive drivers.

All of the stock tires are "all-weather" or 3-season tires. They only work properly in winter in the deep south where they don't know how to spell snow or ice.

 

[Toymaster]

If one chooses to turn off all the fancy electronic aids I have zero issues; a driver should use a vehicle how they are most comfortable. Off-road high speed is one of my most favorite activties. Also, I enjoy sport bikes, of which a modern sport bike has enough nannies to keep a newbie from killing their self and at the same time still enjoy my mid-2000's sport bike with zero aids. As I'm getting older having some nannies between me and the pavement seems like an increasingly good idea. In short, you do you boo.

Just out of interest, why are you disabling traction control? That should only be necessary when trying to spin your way out of a really bad situation and will decrease traction in most circumstances.

Agreed 100% I have my wife in a late model Explorer and nokian hakkapeliitta tires, on a sheet of ice you can floor the throttle and the traction aids will do their job of keeping the vehicle in line and gaining velocity as much as the available traction will allow, this is done in milliseconds. The old fashion way would be to give it some light throttle, steer it straight till inertia is on your side, a matter of seconds of time to get going. One way takes more skill than the other, skills that my wife does not possess.

Not true, Traction control helps in slippery conditions IF and only IF it’s not too bad.
Like wet roads, helps a little with lower speed hydroplaning,

As soon as I slip the second time On anything muddy or cruddy I turn it off,
Oddly I slip less and I move forward faster.

Entirely your call but I'd suggest you take the maverick to a safe location, like a slippery deserted parking lot, and play with it, try using the aids. You may be surprised. It especially helps when the traction is patchy, its reaction time is quicker than a humans.

@Cherokee - It's actually not odd at all.
Traction control does help in those situations you noted.

In very slippery conditions, traction control is trying to put power where the wheels aren't slipping. When all of them are slipping, it doesn't help, and it hurts by dropping power and/or using braking to try to control the wheel spin, and that only makes the situation worse.

Like you, I always turn off traction control on my very frequent forays into the silt mud that makes up the road once I leave my driveway.
In mud, traction control is an automated method to help you get stuck.

As far as the OP's complaint, the adage "where the rubber meets the road" is the actual issue. A car's performance is limited by its contact patches, and most OEM tires are designed to seem adequate on a test ride, which typically doesn't include snow on ice.

Agreed with most. Being in a situation where wheel spin is desired is why you have the disable button, stopped in muddy conditions is one of those times. With on-road winter conditions wheel spin is not desired.

Tires. Tires. Tires. The right tires mean capability and I likes capability.

 

[Cherokee]

Spent the majority of of my life driving without nanny aids.

In my hay day all we wanted and needed was power steering and power brakes. I will say, Radial tires are an Improvement.

As a population I see the need for all this assistance growing because of cell phone distractions and loss of driving skills, partly due to aging, mostly due to lack of focus.

I leave all my nanny aids on and at factory settings. They do nothing when something happens but normal no pressure relaxed driving they are ok.

The more we depend on them the more we invite disaster.

I turn mine off at the first sign of trouble
And will continue to rely on my driving skills not that oh so useless lane assist thing that cuts off at random.

Or how about the time I’m cruising like a BMW in the twisties and it see’s a car in the OTHER lane in a curve and goes HARD into emergency braking without any warning.
Really Ford ? Are you trying to kill your own customers?

I will admit that anti lock brakes are a good thing if the driver is smart enough to learn the proper way to use them.

Signed.
The lone wolf that refuses to be a sheep.

 

[MaverickDragon]

Agreed with most. Being in a situation where wheel spin is desired is why you have the disable button, stopped in muddy conditions is one of those times. With on-road winter conditions wheel spin is not desired.

Agreed.
I noted mud as the reason for TCS disable, because that is where it doesn't work.
Not only when you are stopped, because TCS can create the situation that got you stopped in the first place.
This is based on only 25 years of experience driving in mud every time it rains and I go anywhere beyond my driveway.
The only times I've ever had problems with mud was with TCS enabled, and I lost momentum thanks to TCS cutting power in the vain attempt to control the 4 wheel spin.
I've never got stuck with TCS off on the miles of muddy road I have to drive through.

The opposite is true on frozen conditions, where a judicious application of power helps to keep you going straight, and unlike in mud, where all 4 wheels have the same lack of traction, in frozen conditions there can be considerable differences in slip and grip at each corner.
That is what TCS is designed for, and it works well in frozen and wet.

In mud it is only a problem.

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