Maintenance Schedule (Hybrid Maverick): Oil, Brake Fluid, Air Filter, Spark Plug, Transmission Fluid, Coolant

[mamboman777]

You do know CVT trannies are not the most durable kind right?

https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/highest-mileage-new-york-city-taxis-arent-what-you-think-255766

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[DryHeat]

Yes the manufacturer wants you to not only make it thru the warranty, but for many years beyond.

I've worked on product development teams, heard this come out of managers mouths, but go ahead tell me different.

I can't really "tell you different," because I can't figure out what you are saying.

Is it that they told you they have a secret lab where they designed a perfectly calibrated maintenance scheme that will prevent powertrain failures for 60,000 miles (100,000 for hybrid/electric components), but will allow those failures shortly afterwards?

Because I would definitely believe that...

 

[vap0rtranz]

Maybe its antidotal, but 50K tranny flush for me. 200K for engine coolant, another no go. Coolant becomes acidic over time, but by all means follow that schedule if you put 200K in 3yrs time

Yup.

What wasn't posted to this thread is that Ford's manual says a couple things should be changed more regularly under certain uses. It's typical heavy usage maintenance schedule stuff versus "regular maintenance schedule" but the Mav manual calls it "special operating conditions". Interestingly, towing is considered "special" and the schedule lists a 30k mile tranny fluid change if the Mav operation is"primarily" towing. Hmm.

Point is: anyone could opt to follow these special schedules, even if they don't tow anything, or aren't a taxi, etc.

 

[fbov]

... I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the (transmission fluid is) able to last longer ...

I'd expect the opposite is likely.

A motor home taught me that automatic transmission fluid hates heat. The tranny fluid in an eCVT is not just lubricating, it's cooling the stators of the electric motors. No idea what vehicle usage pattern might heat-stress the stators, but it's one reason I'll stick to mfr. recommendation.

... But why would I believe the manual when some random guy on the internet says different?

Because the random guy on the internet has the car, has driven far enough for an oil change, and is telling you what Ford's system actually does. It's called a "first-person report."

In my experience, Ford's manual's need a lot of work. No one's done a functional review, much less copy editing, in many years. Many things are missing or inaccurate, so I tend to believe my car over the manual. Your call.

For example, at the moment, FordPass says I have "54% oil life remaining" but it thinks I need an oil change in 1,300 miles. It's been 8,700 miles since the last change, but that includes 4,000 EV miles. Sounds like the 54% is right (~9,000 miles to go), and the 1,300 miles is wrong.

That's not obvious without knowledge of how the system works. Some readers may find that useful information.

 

[Texchappy]

Testing oil at intervals will be the only way to prove or disprove the accuracy of what the engineers programmed the olm for.

 

[Wire4money]

I'd expect the opposite is likely.

A motor home taught me that automatic transmission fluid hates heat. The tranny fluid in an eCVT is not just lubricating, it's cooling the stators of the electric motors. No idea what vehicle usage pattern might heat-stress the stators, but it's one reason I'll stick to mfr. recommendation.


Because the random guy on the internet has the car, has driven far enough for an oil change, and is telling you what Ford's system actually does. It's called a "first-person report."

In my experience, Ford's manual's need a lot of work. No one's done a functional review, much less copy editing, in many years. Many things are missing or inaccurate, so I tend to believe my car over the manual. Your call.

For example, at the moment, FordPass says I have "54% oil life remaining" but it thinks I need an oil change in 1,300 miles. It's been 8,700 miles since the last change, but that includes 4,000 EV miles. Sounds like the 54% is right (~9,000 miles to go), and the 1,300 miles is wrong.

That's not obvious without knowledge of how the system works. Some readers may find that useful information.

Don’t think of th eCVT like a typical transmission. There are no clutches to slip and cause heat, no torque converter. The eCVT is more like a differential.

 

[BDennis]

You do know CVT trannies are not the most durable kind right?

Do you know this is a eCVT with planetary gears, not a CVT with belts.
Big difference as these are rock solid with less moving parts than a standard automatic transmission.

 

[DryHeat]

Because the random guy on the internet has the car, has driven far enough for an oil change, and is telling you what Ford's system actually does. It's called a "first-person report."

You know I responded to a post presenting some correct quotes from the manual, right?

You think I was contradicting you, but that is likely because you don't understand that you and the manual are saying the same thing.

Your manual says to change your oil as advised by the Intelligent Oil-Life Monitor, but that you should expect that advice at various mileages depending on use, and that hybrid vehicles may get more miles between changes. (p. 489-490)

And that's exactly what you say you intend to do. Your Oil-Life Monitor says you have a good percentage left and you intend to use it up -- just like the manual tells you to do.

So I guess I'm the random guy on the internet who has the manual, has read far enough to get to the oil-change section, and is telling you what it actually says. Call it a "first-person report."

(BTW, you do seem to have a beef with FordPass -- which I'm not familiar with -- but my understanding is that FordPass is a Ford marketing tool, not an owner's manual.)

 

[Sliphorn]

You do know CVT trannies are not the most durable kind right?

..
Maven? Really? Not so much.
Please do your homework. The eCVT in the hybrid is NOT a traditional CVT. Completely different. eCVT is robust. CVT is possibly robust, it depends on the design.
..

 

[fbov]

... you do seem to have a beef with FordPass ...

I have a beef with inaccurate documentation. It's hard to press a button that's not there.

FordPass is a phone app that allows you to access some of the dashboard data remotely (mileage, oil, tires, fuel level, etc). It also provides remote start. In the case of the oil monitor, FordPass is both accurate (54%) and inaccurate (1,300 miles). It's just one example. Having used my Escape's manual, I have lots of others. Not picking on FordPass at all.

Testing oil at intervals will be the only way to prove or disprove the accuracy of what the engineers programmed the olm for.

I test on removal. Here's what Blackstone saw. (* indicates oil additives) At this mileage, all the wear metals look better than the C-Max, which I tracked to 66K miles. No worries here.

 

[DryHeat]

I have a beef with inaccurate documentation. It's hard to press a button that's not there.
* * *
In the case of the oil monitor, FordPass is both accurate (54%) and inaccurate (1,300 miles).

FordPass? I recommended reading the actual manual instead of listening to unknown people on the internet. I stand by that. I didn't recommend FordPass. (See Google for complaints about FordPass's handling of oil life.)

So here's what really happened. You made a big deal about your first-person oil-change experience being different from (and more reliable than) what is described in the manual. But it turns out -- surprise! -- that what is in the manual tracks exactly with your experience. That didn't make much sense to me.

 

[fbov]

I recommended reading the actual manual i

I have two versions for my 2020, dated 7/2019 and 12/2019, about right for a 1/2020 delivery.

And what I really did:
Post #1 stated that oil changes were 7K to 10K miles in the hybrid. That's wrong. It's 7-10K ICE miles.
Post #5 I corrected the error and presented some real-world data.
Post #6 then repeated the irrelevant EcoBoost information from the manual, along with the cryptic "hybrid vehicles may achieve longer distances between oil changes." This post just points out the manual's inadequacies.
Post #9 brought in your random response, to which I replied in...
Post #19 that folks may want to know what hybrid cars with this oil life monitor will do.

I'm just saying "believe the oil life monitor" because Post #1 didn't.

...There are no clutches to slip and cause heat, no torque converter. The eCVT is more like a differential.

Yes, but it's a differential that shares tranny fluid with a pair of stators rated for ~400 Amps. Each. High power electrical systems are all constrained by their thermal limits. The potential is there to cook the fluid. A good control system design won't allow that.

For reference, the residential electric service at my house is 240V 200A. The tranny fluid is cooling 4x that power. I'll change when I'm told.

 

[DryHeat]

I'm just saying "believe the oil life monitor" because Post #1 didn't.

Since we are reviewing history... I actually responded to Post #6 -- not to Post #1, and not to you. I made the general comment that reading the manual was better than taking contrary advice from a random person on the internet. You assumed I was talking about you, but I wasn’t. Why? Because you gave essentially the same advice as the manual -- “Follow the Oil-Life Monitor.”

You explain that you're “just saying ’believe the oil life monitor’ because Post #1 didn't.” That's great, but you're late to the party. The post I responded to did say that (“Your vehicle comes with an oil change reminder that determines when you should change the engine oil”), as does the manual.

The rest of this is you complaining that the manual is inadequate because -- although it says hybrid vehicles may go longer between oil changes -- you think it should explain about ICE miles versus road miles. That's fine, but do people really need that info to “Follow the Oil-Life Monitor”? If so, should it also include the algorithm used to calculate the effect of towing, mountains, off-road, heat/cold, short trips, etc.?

I get it. You’re a car guy and you want all the nitty-gritty to be in the manual. Personally, I would have liked a full explanation of how MG1 manages the sun gear rotational speed to achieve a near-infinite number of gear ratios in the eCVT. It would have saved me a lot of reading. But I don’t think the manual is inadequate without it.

 

[graesack]

I will change the oil and filter after 500 miles. Then as suggested.

 

[fbov]

You assumed I was talking about you, but I wasn’t.

That's fair; I own that. My apologies.

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