Is the Maverick connected to the internet?

[Amendes]

Does the Maverick somehow connect to the internet?

I have seen references to modems and the vehicle acting as a wifi hot spot. Does this mean that the car has a device that connects to nearby cell towers?

If the car does indeed communicate with cell towers, then

1. Can vehicle movements be tracked by Ford (or anyone else)?

2. Can the vehicle receive commands "over the air" (to update software, turn on accessories, change settings, etc.)

3. Can the modem be removed or disabled?

4. I have seen references to "Ford Pass points", which seem to require pairing a cell phone to the vehicle. Does this enable Ford to collect personal data?

Thanks for any insight you can provide! Some people may not care about these things, but some people do!

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[mav_can]

Yes, it is always connected to the internet when signal is available.

You won’t receive any better answer than just reading the FordPass privacy policy, which contains some very alarming things in my opinion about gathering behavioral data, etc. I believe they say they won’t sell it to third parties but the data is being collected and all it takes is a breach or change of policy down the road for it to fall into the hands of insurance companies.

Seriously, read it, it’s what you’ll be agreeing to if you want to use remote start or any of the FordPass features.

 

[93nighthawk]

1. Yes, along with fuel level, any MIL codes, and tire pressure.
2. Yes, that is how the remote start works (along with lock/unlock)
3. No, it will cause it not to run, that is how the computer gets updates.
4. Yes

 

[Amendes]

Thank you for the response.

It seems crazy that these days that buying a new vehicle may include you being tracked without opting out.

I don't like that.

 

[notfast]

2. Yes, that is how the remote start works (along with lock/unlock)

I beg to differ. Yes, you can lock/unlock and remote start with the FordPass app. But locking/unlocking and remote starting with the key fob (at least on other Fords I've tried; I don't own a Maverick) is a lot faster since it's direct communication and doesn't have to go through cell towers/the internet/back to the car's modem.

3. No, it will cause it not to run, that is how the computer gets updates.

I also beg to differ. I don't know if Ford implemented an OTA update program, but I sorta doubt it. And even if they did, I don't think it'd be the only way to get updates. The firmware can still definitely be flashed by your dealer using an interface tool.

Also, the Telematics Control Unit (TCU, which includes the 4G LTE modem) on every Ford that I've seen with one is fused on its own circuit. Just pull the "Telematics" fuse and the TCU is disabled.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/4g-modem-disabling-instructions.146860/
https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/threads/disconnecting-the-tcu.8499/

It seems crazy that these days that buying a new vehicle may include you being tracked without opting out.

What if I told you that almost everyone is carrying a GPS tracker in their pocket, not only voluntarily, but they are also paying to do it!

(you should read the iOS or Android software usage agreements for some really exciting stuff)

 

[Amendes]

I agree that cell phones also track location! This is why I do not own a cell phone (really!).

 

[Amendes]

And thanks for the links to the information about the TCU.

 

[Larrythelunatic]

Thank you for the response.

It seems crazy that these days that buying a new vehicle may include you being tracked without opting out.

I don't like that.

Me neither!
Do you carry a cell phone?
All of that info is already available to those with the knowledge and equipment to harvest it………WITHOUT your realizing it.
Just give them a reason.
How fast you go…….
How hard you brake……..
How many g’s you pull cornering……..
Welcome to the future.

 

[93nighthawk]

I beg to differ. Yes, you can lock/unlock and remote start with the FordPass app. But locking/unlocking and remote starting with the key fob (at least on other Fords I've tried; I don't own a Maverick) is a lot faster since it's direct communication and doesn't have to go through cell towers/the internet/back to the car's modem.

Sorry, I should have said when using the Fordpass app to lock/unlock.

I also beg to differ. I don't know if Ford implemented an OTA update program, but I sorta doubt it. And even if they did, I don't think it'd be the only way to get updates. The firmware can still definitely be flashed by your dealer using an interface tool.

FMC has been doing OTA updates for a couple years now for SYNC. Also the dealer has access to live info via OTA without hooking up the IDS.

Also, the Telematics Control Unit (TCU, which includes the 4G LTE modem) on every Ford that I've seen with one is fused on its own circuit. Just pull the "Telematics" fuse and the TCU is disabled.

https://www.mustang6g.com/forums/threads/4g-modem-disabling-instructions.146860/
https://www.ranger5g.com/forum/threads/disconnecting-the-tcu.8499/

Yes you can pull the fuse, but that will cause issues.

What if I told you that almost everyone is carrying a GPS tracker in their pocket, not only voluntarily, but they are also paying to do it!

(you should read the iOS or Android software usage agreements for some really exciting stuff)

Truth.

 

[DryHeat]

It seems people have a choice. Use the modern technology built into cars and cell phones and suffer potential intrusions on privacy. Or don't use the technology (and probably still suffer some other intrusions on privacy).

As for me, I'm not going to give up the convenience of my cell phone because of the threat that someone, somewhere, sometime might see some of my precious information. Life is full of risks, and we all have to decide which are worth taking and how to mitigate them.

 

[notfast]

Yes you can pull the fuse, but that will cause issues.

Now you got me curious. What kind of issues are folks seeing?

If I get a Ford with a modem I'll probably just leave it be. I'm not the tinfoil hat wearing type. Google probably knows more about me than I do by now.

I'm (semi-sarcastically) waiting for features-as-a-service.
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/0...ice-bmw-wants-to-sell-car-features-on-demand/

On a side note, one of my former coworkers who is now a repo man is thinking that he might have to change careers again. He went to go repossess a Tesla Model 3. Tesla called and told him exactly where the car was.

He pulled up to the car, verified the VIN, and called Tesla back. The rep said they'd flash the lights, then unlock the car. Then the rep said they'd back the car out of the parking spot, line it up with his flatbed, and put the car in "tow/transport mode".

He loaded the car like normal, but he figures it's not much longer before the car will repossess itself. Stopped making payments? Car will just drive itself back to the nearest secure Tesla-approved location while awaiting further transport.

Tesla previously sent an OTA update to temporarily allow the batteries of some models to discharge to a true 100%, thereby extending the range by about 30 miles.

https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/10/...-update-florida-extend-range-model-s-x-60-60d

Gets you wondering at what point do you not "own" the car, but you're just leasing it from the manufacturer, regardless of whether you physically possess it and legally own it.

 

[8211badger]

Now you got me curious. What kind of issues are folks seeing?

If I get a Ford with a modem I'll probably just leave it be. I'm not the tinfoil hat wearing type. Google probably knows more about me than I do by now.

I'm (semi-sarcastically) waiting for features-as-a-service.
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/0...ice-bmw-wants-to-sell-car-features-on-demand/

On a side note, one of my former coworkers who is now a repo man is thinking that he might have to change careers again. He went to go repossess a Tesla Model 3. Tesla called and told him exactly where the car was.

He pulled up to the car, verified the VIN, and called Tesla back. The rep said they'd flash the lights, then unlock the car. Then the rep said they'd back the car out of the parking spot, line it up with his flatbed, and put the car in "tow/transport mode".

He loaded the car like normal, but he figures it's not much longer before the car will repossess itself. Stopped making payments? Car will just drive itself back to the nearest secure Tesla-approved location while awaiting further transport.

Booming business in new topics for country songs tho. "She took my heart, my dog, and even my truck drove off on me...."

 

[DryHeat]

Tesla previously sent an OTA update to temporarily allow the batteries of some models to discharge to a true 100%, thereby extending the range by about 30 miles.

Gets you wondering at what point do you not "own" the car, but you're just leasing it from the manufacturer, regardless of whether you physically possess it and legally own it.

I'm reading this forum on a Windows computers. Microsoft sends updates to the operating system, the browser, and all my Office apps all the time. Some of the hardware drivers get updates as well.

The way I look at it, I own the computer, but it gets "serviced" automatically. That's ok with me. I was tired of having to update things myself in order to stay ahead of all the new hacks that crop up.

 

[93nighthawk]

Now you got me curious. What kind of issues are folks seeing?

It will throw a CEL that the TCU is malfuntion.

 

[notfast]

The way I look at it, I own the computer, but it gets "serviced" automatically. That's ok with me. I was tired of having to update things myself in order to stay ahead of all the new hacks that crop up.

That's a good way to look at it. I mean, since the dawn of software, very few people actually "own" software, even when they "buy" a copy. It's almost all licensed.

That's why I'm good with SaaS (Software as a Service). I'd rather pay a subscription fee to always have the latest version than buy a license for a static version that'll eventually be unsupported.

It will throw a CEL that the TCU is malfuntion.

Is that it? Does the ECU report it as a type 1 or type 2 DTC? I'd be pretty surprised if it gets reported as a type 1 fault, since those are typically reserved for things that will cause immediate and/or severe damage (like high water temperature or low oil pressure).

If it's a type 2 fault then eh, I wouldn't be concerned. The popup message might get annoying, but the car will still run and drive safely with type 2 faults. I drove over 5,000 miles with P0442. I smoke tested the evap system and figured out that the canister was leaking. Problem is, removing the canister on my particular car required removing the rear subframe, which I was too lazy to do until I got around to installing new suspension.

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